Why Buck's Row?

[Joshua Rogan]

Hi Dave,

But is it likely that he would have killed her out on the street in the early hours of the morning with people like Elizabeth Long and others around going to work etc? Surely it's overwhelmingly likely that she was killed in situ and any blood found in the passageway came from the killer as he made his escape?

Except that, as I posted earlier, Dr Phillips said he made a search of the passage and found no blood. I suspect the report that Simon posted was inaccurate, like the reports of blood on the fence at 25 or of the message left by the killer.

It's possible she was carried unconscious through the passage, of course (or was given a piggy back by her killer, or even that they romped to the back yard in Fatal Attraction style). But it's always easier to get a living person to move than a dead one. And she had already said "yes", according to Mrs Long.

[Simon Wood]

Hi David,

Amelia Farmer did not testify that Chapman "took to prostitution at night."

That's your spin.

The police did not recognise any of the C5. Nor did they recognise them once they had their names.

Regards,

Simon

[Herlock Sholmes]

Hi David,

Believe what you want to believe.

Why did the H Division police not recognise her as a local prostitute?

Regards,

Simon

Did the police at the time keep extensive files on every prostitute? What if she'd never been arrested? Avoiding the police would have been a primary skill for a prostitute (and still is, for all I know that is )

[Herlock Sholmes]

Reckon there is a reasonable case for her being quietly dragged unconscious from the street to the back yard.

Hi Dave,

But is it likely that he would have killed her out on the street in the early hours of the morning with people like Elizabeth Long and others around going to work etc? Surely it's overwhelmingly likely that she was killed in situ and any blood found in the passageway came from the killer as he made his escape?

[David Orsam]

Believe what you want to believe.

It's not a question of me believing anything Simon. Amelia Farmer testified that Chapman took to prostitution at night. That's just a fact.

Why did the H Division police not recognise her as a local prostitute?

If you can show me some evidence that H Division police knew every single woman who worked as a prostitute within Whitechapel I will happily answer your question.

[Simon Wood]

Hi David,

Believe what you want to believe.

Why did the H Division police not recognise her as a local prostitute?

Regards,

Simon

[David Orsam]

From the Daily News report of Farmer's testimony:

"The Coroner - Is it correct that she got money in the streets?

The Witness - I am afraid that she was not particular how she earned her living. She has told me that she was out late at night sometimes."

Asking if Chapman "got money in the streets" was the same as asking if Chapman was a prostitute.

[David Orsam]

Hi David,

You've really got the bit between your teeth.

Lots of people who earned their living on the streets were not prostitutes.

Are you being serious Simon? I mean, at night?

Here is the evidence of Farmer as reported in the London Evening Post:

"She did crochet work and made antimacassars for a living and also sold flowers. Witness was afraid she also went on the streets at night. In fact, deceased had told her she did".

I wonder why Farmer was "afraid" that she went on the streets at night.

You do know that going on the streets at night means prostitution don't you, Simon?

[Simon Wood]

Hi David,

You've really got the bit between your teeth.

Lots of people who earned their living on the streets were not prostitutes.

Regards,

Simon

[Simon Wood]

Hi DJA,

Evening News, 8th September 1888—

“The supposition finds ready acceptance that the poor woman was murdered outside and taken into this yard, by those who knew the place well. This is upheld by the fact that spots of blood are lying thick in the narrow passage leading from the street into the yard, and the blood marks where the body was found must have been caused by its being deposited there, there being no signs of any struggle having taken place in the vicinity.”

Regards,

Simon

[David Orsam]

Now, here's a rather more complete version of Ms Farmer's inquest evidence than one finds in the Times.

From the Star of 10 September:

"I am afraid deceased used to earn her living partly on the streets. She was a very straightforward woman when she was sober, clever and industrious with her needle; but she could not take much drink without getting intoxicated. She had been living a very irregular life all the time I've known her."

Go on and explain that one away Simon.

[Simon Wood]

Hi David,

I do indeed.

And it was.

Regards,

Simon

[DJA]

Dr Phillips didn't think so, according to the Telegraph;

"In your opinion did she enter the yard alive? - I am positive of it. I made a thorough search of the passage, and I saw no trace of blood, which must have been visible had she been taken into the yard."

Reckon there is a reasonable case for her being quietly dragged unconscious from the street to the back yard.

[David Orsam]

Amelia Palmer may well have been suggesting that Annie Chapman did late night cleaning.

Oh, ha ha!

Do you recall your use of the expression "sublimely ridiculous explanation" in your book?

I think you've demonstrated a far better example than the one you were referring to.

[Simon Wood]

Hi David,

Not to you, obviously.

And it's early afternoon here.

Amelia Palmer may well have been suggesting that Annie Chapman did late night cleaning.

Regards,

Simon