Photographs?

[Rob Clack]

Hi Robert

He moved to West India Dock Road in 1894 which was just down the road.

Rob

[Mayerling]

Hi Jeff,

The Thames Police only had jurisdiction between Battersea Bridge and Barking Creek. Chiswick was about 5 miles away. The only reason the Thames Police would go that far would be for Special Occasions like the boat race.

Rob

P.S. there would have been a photograph taken of Catherine Mylett and the Pinchin Street Torso.

Thanks for explaining that point to me Rob.

Jeff

[Harry D]

So it's looking more likely that a photograph WAS taken but lost, along with god knows what else.

[GUT]

They would have gotten one Gut, and rapidly.

Monty

Thanks Monty.

[GUT]

I am not sure if K Division had a regular photographer at the time Robert. They may have used Joseph Martin who was at Cannon Street Road at the time.

Rob

But if he was unavailable, who would they then turn to?

[GUT]

Somewhere, I think in the first edition of his "The Compleat Jack the Ripper", Rumbelow mentioned that when he found one of the maps it looked like it was baked. It is just possible that many of the photos were lost because they were poorly stored and fell apart.

I still have a major problem with Montague Druitt's death. In a book about Scotland Yard by George Dilnot he had a chapter about the "Thames Police" and how they photographed the corpses of those whose bodies they found - for identification purposes. They were doing this before 1888. No picture of the dead Monty has ever appeared.

Jeff

G'day Jeff, but would there have been any reason to take any precautions to retain any photo of the dead Montie that had been taken?

It seems like it would have been one of hundreds of closed cases, filed away somewhere and at some time disposed of as just another suicide.

[Rob Clack]

But if he was unavailable, who would they then turn to?

Any number of local photographers. Some later murders I have looked into a Police Sergeant took photographs of crimes scenes and mortuary photographs, so there are several possibilities.

[GUT]

Any number of local photographers. Some later murders I have looked into a Police Sergeant took photographs of crimes scenes and mortuary photographs, so there are several possibilities.

G'day Rob

How much later wre the ones taken by a police Sergeant.

In 1888 I would have thought it was still to specialist a task. But maybe I'm wrong there. By the early 1900s it was an almost any person task.

[Rob Clack]

How much later wre the ones taken by a police Sergeant.

Early 1900s. Also I should add that other Divisions would have had a photographer,

[GUT]

Early 1900s. Also I should add that other Divisions would have had a photographer,

I guess that's all they'd have to do, send a runner to the next division.

[Mayerling]

G'day Jeff, but would there have been any reason to take any precautions to retain any photo of the dead Montie that had been taken?

It seems like it would have been one of hundreds of closed cases, filed away somewhere and at some time disposed of as just another suicide.

G'day GUT

Rob pointed out earlier to me on this thread that the Thames Police did not handle the area at Chiswick, so that they probably did not take Montie's photo. But you never know. Some photo could have been taken of the corpse when it was found - still it might have been disposed of as just another suicide later on.

Anyway it does not look like any photo will turn up. Just too bad, I think.

Jeff

[Monty]

Solely as add on to Rob's posts,

The 1903 The Fingerprint Branch would conduct scene of crime visits with a camera, to photograph fingerprints. The cameras were based at Scotland Yard, and would be called out by the divisions as and when required. At this stage there were two cameras held at the Yard, each with its own log book, and every visit was noted in this book.

The book was divided up thusly -

Date of visit
Scene of Crime address
The division who requested the visit
The Police Officer who accompanied the camera
The Result, if the photographs/fingerprints were of good quality, if they were used as evidence and the result of the trial.

In later years, time spent at the scene was also added to the log book. Below are some images of the book and the camera.

Now, it must be reiterated that this was in relation to fingerprints, not dead bodies, however knowing the Met, this process would most likely, in my opinion, be utilised with regards the Photographic Team also.

So there would be a log, also an expense sheet/form (which I think I may have, I shall look) for the independent photographer to complete and return.

Monty

[GUT]

Solely as add on to Rob's posts,

The 1903 The Fingerprint Branch would conduct scene of crime visits with a camera, to photograph fingerprints. The cameras were based at Scotland Yard, and would be called out by the divisions as and when required. At this stage there were two cameras held at the Yard, each with its own log book, and every visit was noted in this book.

The book was divided up thusly -

Date of visit
Scene of Crime address
The division who requested the visit
The Police Officer who accompanied the camera
The Result, if the photographs/fingerprints were of good quality, if they were used as evidence and the result of the trial.

In later years, time spent at the scene was also added to the log book. Below are some images of the book and the camera.

Now, it must be reiterated that this was in relation to fingerprints, not dead bodies, however knowing the Met, this process would most likely, in my opinion, be utilised with regards the Photographic Team also.

So there would be a log, also an expense sheet/form (which I think I may have, I shall look) for the independent photographer to complete and return.

Monty

G'day Monty

When you say


At this stage there were two cameras held at the Yard, each with its own log book, and every visit was noted in this book.

Was that only for the fingerprint dept, or did they only have two cameras at the whole Yard.

[Monty]

The Yard, initially.

However more were purchased.

Monty

[Monty]

Apologies GUT,

Just got what you were asking.

The Met employed their own Photographers early 1901. They initially had two cameras.

In July of the same year the Fingerprint team was set up, and they were allocated two cameras. So the overall Yard allocation doubled within months.

As I said, as photography became a valued evidence gathering tool, more were purchased or, if required, hired.

Monty