Martha Tabram--First In The Series

[Chava]

So now let's review the facts:

Middle-aged destitute drunken East End prostitute is murdered with a knife or knives in George Yard Buildings, a mere stone's throw from the other victims. She was drunk on the night she died. And (my own little hobby horse) she was killed on a broader landing after going up a narrow stairwell. No one hears any kind of struggle. She is found laid out with her skirt pulled up and her legs akimbo just like the others.

She was estimated as having died 3-4 hours before the PM, which took place around 3.00 am. But someone walked past the landing where she was found at 1.50 am and saw nothing. So she was killed elsewhere and moved? Or she was killed later than the doctors believed.

A soldier was seen in the area at around 2.00 am. We know she went off to George Yard to have sex with a soldier she had picked up earlier. But that was around 11.45 pm. So either he spend a lot of time with her before he killed her. Or he didn't have anything to do with it.

If this was a Ripper killing, it's likely the first. Is it this killing that starts him off? Did Tabram do or say something to him that hurt and angered him so much that he killed her in a frenzy and then killed her--or women like her--over and over again? The attack is pretty sexual. Stab wounds rather than rips. Did he discover a potence he hadn't had before while he was doing it? Did he refine his technique a 'lover' and is that why his MO changes?

[The Grave Maurice]

Sorry, Chava, you've lost me already. How could the PM take place at 3:00 a.m.? Reeves didn't find the body until 4:50.

[Chava]

Sorry, Chava, you've lost me already. How could the PM take place at 3:00 a.m.? Reeves didn't find the body until 4:50.

Maurice, I"m sorry. I was checking the post-mortem time, which was 5.30 am, and I was thinking '3 hours before' and I wrote '3.00 am'. That was dumb, and I apologize.

[The Grave Maurice]

Like I've never made a mistake. Believe me, no apology is necessary.

I'd like to hear more of your current theory, though. Bill Beadle has just published a reiteration of his belief that Martha was a victim of JtR in the current issue of The Journal of the Whitechapel Society (Feb. 2009). The subject appears to be heating up again.

[Chava]

The Tabram killing, like the Kelly killing, show significant departures from the other 4. The main argument against Tabram is the stabbing. Does someone go from stabbing to ripping? And why does the Ripper rip at all? I suspect the cuts are made to get at the internal organs for some reason and to take trophies where possible. This doesn't happen in Tabram, and happens in a weird kind of a way in Kelly. I don't have a theory, in that I'm not sure Tabram is a Ripper victim. But it interests me that exactly the same kind of woman is killed in the same kind of circumstances and is possibly displayed after death. Plenty of people disagree, and point out the commonality of Tabram's appearance.

Same like Kelly, if she is a Ripper victim, I suspect she wasn't just a random kill, but had some personal connexion with the killer. Perhaps she'd tried to nick his wallet or whatever. I do think she did or said something inadvised, which brought all hell down on her.

[CLK]

Yes I think he could have stabbed her and thought to himself "that feels good" so he strangled her and stabbed her 38 more times. He may have had demons for a long time and after Martha had the confidence to act on them, so he acted on the urge to kill on the 31st of August and killed Polly.

[Sam Flynn]

... the Kelly killing, show[s] significant departures from the other 4.

That's a funny way to spell "Stride", Chava

[Chava]

Ah well, Gareth, you see I think Stride was an aborted Ripper killing. And I am not at all sure that Kelly is a Ripper killing. But I think, if you want to discuss Stride, it should be on a Stride thread...
xxxxChava

[harry]

Chava'
An article in an overseas newspaper,published on October8th 1888,received from a London source dated September 27 1888,states Chapman as the fourth Ripper murder,Nicholl's as the third,Tabram as the second,an unnamed as the first,and a woman in Gateshead,near Newcastle on Tyne,as the fifth.

[harry]

Chava,
A correction.They were not then known as the Ripper crimes.They are referred to as the east end murders,that is,the first four are.The fifth is stated to be by the same person.

[Mitch Rowe]

I think one of the most credible theories that Martha was a victim is the Ripper drive by theory. The stairwell isnt a likely place for Martha to take the ripper. It doesnt seem like the soldiers were involved.

[Chava]

Harry, thanks for that! I think you're referring to this:

Weekly Herald
September 28th, 1888
A TERRIBLE MURDER AT
GATESHEAD.
_____

WOMAN SHOCKINGLY MUTILATED.
___

A young woman named Jane Beatmoor, 28 years of age, was the victim of a horrible murder at Birtley, near Gateshead on Saturday night or Sunday morning. It appears that the deceased, who was in delicate health, had been at the Gateshead Dispensary on Saturday for medicine, and on returning home she went out to purchase some sweets with which to take her medicine. She called at several farms while she was out, and at half-past seven at night left the house of an acquaintance named Mr. Newell, evidently with the intention of returning home. She had not arrived at eleven o'clock, and her mother and step-father went to look for her without success, and concluded that she must have spent the night with some neighbour. Early in the morning, a miner, named John Fish, going to work found the body of the deceased at the bottom of the railway embankment in a horribly mutilated condition. The conty police were communicated with and Superintendent Harrison and Sergeant Hutchinson, of Birtley, were soon on the spot. A closer inspection revealed the fact that the lower part of the deceased's body had been cut open and the entrails torn out. She was also cut about the face. The body was conveyed home and a doctor sent for. The affair has caused quite a panic in the district, the resemblance to the Whitechapel tragedies encouraging the idea that the maniac who has been at work in London has travelled down to the North of England to pursue his fiendish vocation. No arrests have been made. Further inquiries made at the scene of the murder do not diminish the shocking brutality of the crime. The unfortunate woman is stabbed in three places--once in the bowels and twice in the face. The wound in the body is very deep, the knife having knocked a piece off the vertebrae. The body was found only a few hundred yards from the Girls' Home by the side of the Colliery Railway. She was last seen at eight o'clock on Saturday night alone, and the man Fish found her about half-past seven on Sunday morning. There were no marks of a struggle, and no trace of footsteps. The police are completely baffled, as the murderer has left not the slightest clue. During Sunday thousands of persons visited the spot where the body was found, and the affair has caused the utmost consternation

Now there are a bunch of similarities to the Ripper murders, and a couple to the Tabram murder. There are stab wounds to the body, one of which has penetrated bone. As well, the organs have been messed-about with, and the face has been mutilated.

I think the Ripper drive-by idea is a bit far-fetched. In my opinion, that landing would have been an ideal place for a prostitute to take a client...

[Sam Flynn]

Ah well, Gareth, you see I think Stride was an aborted Ripper killing. And I am not at all sure that Kelly is a Ripper killing. But I think, if you want to discuss Stride, it should be on a Stride thread...

I don't wish to discuss her, Chava - you may be sure of that. However, since it was thee you brought up Kelly on a Tabram thread...

[Sam Flynn]

Harry, thanks for that! I think you're referring to this:

Here's a cracking article on the subject by Alan Sharp...

http://www.casebook.org/dissertations/rn-beadmore.html

[Mitch Rowe]

I think the Ripper drive-by idea is a bit far-fetched. In my opinion, that landing would have been an ideal place for a prostitute to take a client...

Right..

It occured to me the police also thought Martha was with a client on the landing. So.. If its JTR and he goes with Martha to the landing he ends up stabbing her multiple times. And it seems the stabs were directed at vital areas on the body.

Why would JTR do this and not attempt to remove organs? Maybe because it was a landing and JTR does like what he did with Eddowes. He cuts(pun not intended)corners when he feels he doesnt have the time.

Maybe just stabbing the vital organs was enough mutilation to satisfy JTR for the conditions he thought he was in?