Soliciting or night attack.

[KatBradshaw]

I am starting this thread due to the discussion going on in another thread.
Do you think Mary met the Ripper on the street or do you think she was attacked as she slept in her room.

For my part I think that she met the Ripper on the street.

[c.d.]

Hi Kat,

I have never understood why a killer would take a chance on breaking into a prostitute's room when he could be invited in as a client. I think she opened the door for Jack and that she knew him in some capacity. It is also possible that she was soliciting and brought him back to her room.

c.d.

[Ben]

Hi CD,

I have never understood why a killer would take a chance on breaking into a prostitute's room when he could be invited in as a client.

The logical answer would be to minimise the chances of the intended prostitute victim either crying out or fighting back, or both. Killing a person in their sleep is obviously the easier option if it can be acheived. As far as I'm concerned, both proposals (client and intruder) have merit, with neither one being appreciably more likely than the other. There is even the possibility, given the superficial congruity between the Cox and Lewis suspect descriptions, that both occured, i.e. that the blotchy man's 11:45pm visit was a reconnaissance visit of sorts and that he returned later once he had assessed the situation.

Best regards,
Ben

[KatBradshaw]

That is an interesting slant on it Ben, it was both. He came by then returned when she was settled.
If this was the case then would we assume that he recieved Kelly's services?

[c.d.]

Hi CD,



The logical answer would be to minimise the chances of the intended prostitute victim either crying out or fighting back, or both. Killing a person in their sleep is obviously the easier option if it can be acheived. As far as I'm concerned, both proposals (client and intruder) have merit, with neither one being appreciably more likely than the other. There is even the possibility, given the superficial congruity between the Cox and Lewis suspect descriptions, that both occured, i.e. that the blotchy man's 11:45pm visit was a reconnaissance visit of sorts and that he returned later once he had assessed the situation.

Best regards,
Ben

Hi Ben,

..."if it can be achieved" is the operative phrase here. The killer would have to be reasonably certain that he could enter the room unobserved and without making any noise and that the person on the bed was indeed actually asleep.

c.d.

[Phil Carter]

Hello Ben, Kat, c.d.,all,

Indeed Ben, and the added implication here (with Blotchy man) is that she may well have known him. The same COULD be said about Astrakan man too, but in the scenario you present, with Blotchy, it makes the possibility grow.

best wishes

Phil

[Ben]

Hi all,

It's quite possible that Blotchy was "serviced" on the visit observed by Mary Cox, although Kelly's prolonged singing session might indicate otherwise. As for CD's point, the killer could have acquired that "reasonable certainty" that Kelly was alone and asleep if he was either familiar with her habits or had been monitering the premises from a vantage point, or both.

Of possible interest to the blotchy-as-killer premise is the fact that both thick carrotty moustaches and blotchy/sunburned complexions cropped up in the James Taylor and Ada Wilson sightings respectively.

Best regards,
Ben

[Addy]

I think she met him solliciting. She probably had more clients that night. However, Paul Begg describes the opinion of the doctor that she seemed to be asleep when attacked. That could mean that she knew her client and was enough at ease to fall asleep. Or, if she was indeed very drunk, that could be the reason she "dozed off" before her client could get into the bed too.

[c.d.]

Hi Addy,

Welcome to the boards.

c.d.

[KatBradshaw]

Deciding if the idea that she was asleep when she was attacked is key really. If she was then that either means she was with someone she felt comfrotable enough with to fall asleep or she was attacked as she slept.

What I am not sure about is why they thought that she was asleep? If it is because she was laying down could that not just as easily suggest she was getting ready to sex?

[richardnunweek]

Hi,
The presense of the bedroll, which appears to been in a rolled up position, and what looks like a garter or sock on her right leg[ much discussed] to me would suggest a getting ready for sex, with the client in impatient mode.
Whats more would depict a morning scene rather then middle of the night.
Regards Richard.

[KatBradshaw]

Uhoh!! We are getting dangerously close to bolster debate here!

[richardnunweek]

Hi Kat,
Heaven forbid, just an opinion of mine, on the murder scene
Regards Richard.

[KatBradshaw]

Hi,
The presense of the bedroll, which appears to been in a rolled up position, and what looks like a garter or sock on her right leg[ much discussed] to me would suggest a getting ready for sex, with the client in impatient mode.
Whats more would depict a morning scene rather then middle of the night.
Regards Richard.

Yes, or she came home sozzled and past out in her clothes.

[richardnunweek]

Hi Kat,
That being the case, she managed to undress down to a chemise, and if the crime scene, according to my opinion shows a sock on her right leg, then she nearly made it before passing out.
I still prefer the undressing for sex, awaiting Mr Porter to arrive choice.
Richard.