Mary Jane's grave

[Christine]

Thanks, Philip. I've seen at least some of the Coram images, but not that one, obviously.

[Tenth Bell]

Good evening, friends...
Glad you enjoyed the pics. It was a damp and terribly dreary day that morning in the churchyard. That gravesite does seem a bit 'busy', doesn't it? I myself left Mary 4-pence while visiting, but it does seem to be a little cluttered ( and given the weather, was very muddy...). I truly love the old, tattered, wooden cross and rosary beads. The same ones can be seen in the picture (not mine) of the previous grave marker ( the one with the tiny gin bottle present.) This same wooden rosary was hanging around the large black cross when I was there.
Warspite, Mr. Dittles is the small cat, and the little Teddy appears to be a gift from a Canadian visitor, and has written on it in marker "MJK" as well a drawn-on 'heart'.

[anna]

Sorry folks,it wasn't meant as a criticism of anyone.


Perhaps,if the next person who visits,does feel they could give it a wash down and clear it of the stuff that's past it's sell by date,it would help make it look less tacky!!...I do like the little figurine of Christ..spotted it in Phils piccie,glad to see it's still there,as it adds a nice touch.


ANNA.xx

[jason_c]

Agreed, it is tacky.

Anyone else a bit iffy at someone leaving Kelly's likeness at the grave?

[anna]

Let's just say..I prefer the cat.

But it's a matter of choice...we all have different preferences on Casebook!!!!

[kensei]

I left the picture at the grave thinking what a shame it was that the only image most people ever see of Mary is one of the most disgusting photos ever published (the crime scene pic), and that it would be nice if visitors could see at least an approximate version of who she really was. I'm sorry if some don't think it was appropriate.

For Warspite- just a little clarification on Mr. Diddles. That was the name of the kitten owned by Elizabeth Prater, Mary's upstairs neighbor, which crawled across her neck and awakened her just in time to hear the cry of "Oh, murder!" I wonder if anyone knows who left the cat figurine at the grave, or if they were thinking of Diddles when they did it.

Some have noted the coins left at the grave. They actually made me cringe a little. I was thinking, come on people, she's not a working girl anymore. Do you have to remind her she was an Unfortunate even in death? But then my girlfriend suggested that perhaps the coins were left to pay the Ferryman. If that's the case I'd feel a little better.

[Khanada]

I left the picture at the grave thinking what a shame it was that the only image most people ever see of Mary is one of the most disgusting photos ever published (the crime scene pic), and that it would be nice if visitors could see at least an approximate version of who she really was. I'm sorry if some don't think it was appropriate.

I like that you left it there. Why not? I mean, I've seen headstones where there is either an actual photo of the person mounted on the stone, or an image of them etched into it. Those don't seem inappropriate, so leaving the Coram picture surely isn't. (What would be inappropriate to leave would be the crime scene pic!)

Some have noted the coins left at the grave. They actually made me cringe a little. I was thinking, come on people, she's not a working girl anymore. Do you have to remind her she was an Unfortunate even in death? But then my girlfriend suggested that perhaps the coins were left to pay the Ferryman. If that's the case I'd feel a little better.

I've seen lots of photos of famous and not-so-famous graves with coins left on them. I don't know why people do this, but I think your girlfriend's Ferryman suggestion may be one reason. The idea that comes to mind for me is, well, people simply like to leave things at a gravesite. (Andy Warhol is buried in my [as well as his] hometown of Pittsburgh, PA. I've never seen a photo of Warhol's headstone where it doesn't have at least one Campbell's tomato soup can left on it.) OK, obvious. But why coins? Well...

Let's say that you found yourself at a gravesite that was meaningful to you in some manner, but that you didn't know beforehand that you were going to be there. So what's something you'd be likely to have on hand that you could leave behind? Spare change. (I know I am never, ever, without at least a few coins in my pocket -- just in case I get a wild hair and decide to go downtown on a whim for a walk and/or ice cream. The DQ will take my bank card, but the parking meters won't!)

[Archaic]

Hi, Kensei... Might I just say, I feel you left Jane's picture of Mary for all the right reasons?

That's what matters. (Ignore the rest)

Best regards, Archaic

[Christine]

Maybe it's like throwing coins in a fountain--a small gift to charity appeases the (water) spirit and gives you good luck. I would assume that the coins end up in the charity box eventually.

[kensei]

Thanks everyone for the affirmations.

I had heard before I went to the grave that people would occasionally leave gin bottles and things like that there, things Mary would have enjoyed in life, meaning well I suppose but coming across as completely inappropriate. I guess I took the coins to be a bit like that, like those her clients used to pay her. Khanada offers some good alternative thoughts.

[Jane Coram]

Just a quickie, as the actress said to the bishop.........

I suppose I ought to comment on the posts about the painting of Mary.......I'm certainly not offended by anyone saying they think it shouldn't be there.......but, I honestly don't think that it's tacky, curly maybe, but not tacky.

I actually used to live directly opposite the cemetery in an upstairs flat, and I could see almost the whole cemetery from my living room window. I used to often look across and think of Mary.........well............she was almost my neighbour..........

I grew up with women just like Mary, and I honestly think that most of them would have thought it was rather nice to be remembered by others at all, let alone mind what was put on their grave within reason. I honestly don't think that Mary would have minded the gin bottles, or the cats, and certainly not the flowers, no matter how faded and battered they are. People generally seem to have given her a hell of a lot more respect in death than they ever did in life.

I've been asked before if I minded people putting the paintings on the graves, (where they are known) and I've always given my blessing. I am not sure if it's still there, but certainly until recently there was a photocopy of the mortuary photograph of Annie in the cemetery office.......and that is offensive.

I painted the portraits to try and show how the victims might have looked in life if they had been dealt a better lot.........and I don't see how giving the victims a bit of their dignity back is a bad thing.........but each to their own.

Much love you lot of reprobates

Janie

xxxx

[Tenth Bell]

Hi everyone,
I suppose that Khanada is exactly right - at least in my case. I wasn't sure whether or not I would make it to St. Patrick's on my visit, and even then, was quite pressed for time. Although - I felt compelled to leave 'a little something' for Mary, as a token of my esteem, but like many before me - did not have much with me.
I had just come off a wonderful tour the night before, with London Walks. And during a short spiel on the life of a 'typical East End' working girl, Donald Rumbelow mentioned that a woman's services could be had for little more than the cost of a loaf of day-old bread (or even the loaf itself!), however for her to be able to sleep in a covered space, sheltered and maybe warm, leaning up against a rope so as not to fall over, cost:2 pence. And for the same girl to be able to lay her head on a pillow for the night, after a long and tiring day, in a lodging room: 4 pence. This having been very fresh in my mind, my intention at the graveside was to make a small gesture - in the limited way I could - to say to Mary Kelly, "Look, it is a pleasure for me to be able to visit the place where you now rest. And had I known you 'around town' in 1888, I want you to know that I would gladly have given you the 4 pence for the 'good room', and without your need to earn it." And that is why I left my 4p.
No doubt there could be myriad reasons, as we are individuals, but yes I think Khanada hit the nail right on the head.

[Ally]

Agreed, it is tacky.

Anyone else a bit iffy at someone leaving Kelly's likeness at the grave?

Why is it more iffy than leaving bottles of booze? Or anything else? More iffy than leaving a cat that had nothing to do with her? Or tossing money on her grave?

I don't understand how it's any more "iffy" than anything else?

[anna]

Hi all....

Nobody said Jane's picture was tacky.Someone else said they were uneasy with it being there,and I said if given the choice between the two,I'd prefer Mr Diddles...which I would....no offence meant.

The grave does look tacky.....because it is overladen with stuff that is past it's sell-by date...dead flowers in flower pots that have fallen over,plus faded plastic flowers and empty white plastic containers.It's just common decency to tidy it up...no matter who is planted below it.We noted that it needed a clean,as the stonework had got grubby.

But there you go...evidently Mary would like it that way.

ANNAx

[jason_c]

Why is it more iffy than leaving bottles of booze? Or anything else? More iffy than leaving a cat that had nothing to do with her? Or tossing money on her grave?

I don't understand how it's any more "iffy" than anything else?

The picture was the first thing that caught my eye.

I also have a hang up about the continual idealising of Kelly. This picture fits into that category.