Barricaded

[Pierre]

Kelly inquest: Coroner: Did you hear beds or tables being pulled about?

Walter Dew, I Caught Crippen:

"On the bed, which was drawn obliquely across the small room, was all that remained of a good-looking and buxom young woman..."


Sheffield Daily Telegraph 12th Nov 1888 & Kirkintilloch Herald 14th Nov 1888 + MJK3:

[David Orsam]

Oh my dear boy, are we believing what journalists write in newspapers now?

[David Orsam]

Previous paragraph in the same report from the Sheffield Daily Telegraph of 12 Nov 1888:

'The non appearance of the bloodhounds was afterwards accounted for. During the recent trials in Surrey the animals bolted, and, it is understood, have not been accounted for.'

False.

[David Orsam]

We can rely on unsourced and unsubstantiated newspaper reports or we can rely on the official inquest sources and the sworn testimony of the first person into the room, Dr Philips:

'On the door being opened it knocked against a table, the table I found close to the left-hand side of the bedstead and the bedstead was close up against the wooden partition...'

That of course is perfectly consistent with the coroner thinking that the table and the bedstead might have been slightly pulled about.

[Pierre]

Oh my dear boy, are we believing what journalists write in newspapers now?

"We" I take it is you since you say "we believing" and obviously know nothing about what I believe or not.

Pierre

[David Orsam]

"We" I take it is you since you say "we believing" and obviously know nothing about what I believe or not.

Not me my dear boy, not since you gave me a lecture about how those ghastly journalists fabricate stories to sell newspapers in order to make money - so I know you would never place any reliance on them.

[Pierre]

We can rely on unsourced and unsubstantiated newspaper reports or we can rely on the official inquest sources and the sworn testimony of the first person into the room, Dr Philips:

'On the door being opened it knocked against a table, the table I found close to the left-hand side of the bedstead and the bedstead was close up against the wooden partition...'

That of course is perfectly consistent with the coroner thinking that the table and the bedstead might have been slightly pulled about.

We don´t need to rely on sources. But we know they exist.

Pierre

[Pierre]

Not me my dear boy, not since you gave me a lecture about how those ghastly journalists fabricate stories to sell newspapers in order to make money - so I know you would never place any reliance on them.

I have never used the words "ghastly" or "fabricate". Those are your words.

Pierre

[David Orsam]

We don´t need to rely on sources. But we know they exist.

Yes we do, my dear boy, and the sources tell us that when the door to Kelly's room was opened, it knocked against a table, not the bed.

[David Orsam]

I have never used the words "ghastly" or "fabricate". Those are your words.

Oh yes my dear boy, they are my words summarising your lecture.

[Pierre]

Yes we do, my dear boy, and the sources tell us that when the door to Kelly's room was opened, it knocked against a table, not the bed.

The point is that there are many different sources.

There is no source saying the door "knocked against a bed".

[David Orsam]

The point is that there are many different sources.

Not really my dear boy. We have some newspaper articles and, against that, we have the direct testimony from the inquest.

[David Orsam]

There is no source saying the door "knocked against a bed".

Indeed not, my dear boy, but we do have a very reliable source saying the door knocked against a table.

[David Orsam]

Oh yes my dear boy, they are my words summarising your lecture.

Now my dear boy, here are some of your exact words:

"The reason for the higher position of the inquest source is not per se that it is an original.

The reason is that reporters and editors had their own interests when writing about the case. They sold newspapers so they had very clear commercial interests.

The inquest papers where not sold on a market and therefore were not connencted to any commercial interests."

[Pierre]

Not really my dear boy. We have some newspaper articles and, against that, we have the direct testimony from the inquest.

Yes, really. And the second point is that the past was complex. And the third point is that one factor explanations often are not valid.