I know her

[GUT]

We all know Joe identified Mary, by hair, ears, eyes, whatever.

I have never had an issue with him identifying her by her ears, eyes or hair, in fact if they had been in an intimate relationship for a year I would find it strange if he couldn't, I know I could identify Mrs Gut by her little toe, if that was all they had.

But I had a thought last night.

Thinking of the horrific sight that must have been before him, is it possible that (if he believed it was Mary) Joe would have said anything to avoid being asked to take a second look.

So in his own mind he is convinced it's Mary, barely looks, says "Yep it's her"

"How do you recognise her" police ask.

first thing he thinks of "Her hair (or ear) and eyes.

[Pcdunn]

That's an interesting idea, Gut. He gave a fast identification, just to get out of there, and the cops pretty much had to take his word, as he was her latest Mister, after all.

I know that I (and perhaps a few others on here) have wondered if the corpse wasn't Mary Jeanette Kelly, after all. Did she lend the place to another female friend, spend the night elsewhere, and return to find the scene of carnage, and was that why she was seen vomiting on the pavement the following morning? And did Joe identify the corpse as Mary's, because he believed it?

Or, perhaps going the route of conspiracy theories, could MJK and Joe Barnett have been in the loop about a plot to hoax "Mary's" death and allow her to escape. In this version, maybe Joe was ordered to, or coerced to, give the identification by unknown parties.

[DJA]

Or, perhaps going the route of conspiracy theories, could MJK and Joe Barnett have been in the loop about a plot to hoax "Mary's" death and allow her to escape. In this version, maybe Joe was ordered to, or coerced to, give the identification by unknown parties.

Reckon Jack murdered the person he was seeking,however that is a very interesting idea.
Requires a lot of thought.

[JadenCollins]

That's an interesting idea, Gut. He gave a fast identification, just to get out of there, and the cops pretty much had to take his word, as he was her latest Mister, after all.

I know that I (and perhaps a few others on here) have wondered if the corpse wasn't Mary Jeanette Kelly, after all. Did she lend the place to another female friend, spend the night elsewhere, and return to find the scene of carnage, and was that why she was seen vomiting on the pavement the following morning? And did Joe identify the corpse as Mary's, because he believed it?

Or, perhaps going the route of conspiracy theories, could MJK and Joe Barnett have been in the loop about a plot to hoax "Mary's" death and allow her to escape. In this version, maybe Joe was ordered to, or coerced to, give the identification by unknown parties.

That's exactly what I've been on about from the very beginning. I'm glad you two share my view.

What I think happened is that she did lend her place to another female. She came back the next morning and saw the corpse of the woman, panicked and left in a hurry. As far as I remember there's a witness who saw her that morning, no?

[GUT]

That's exactly what I've been on about from the very beginning. I'm glad you two share my view.

What I think happened is that she did lend her place to another female. She came back the next morning and saw the corpse of the woman, panicked and left in a hurry. As far as I remember there's a witness who saw her that morning, no?

Caroline Maxwell and Maurice Lewis both said they saw her

[JadenCollins]

Caroline Maxwell and Maurice Lewis both said they saw her

Yeah, those two.

So it's possible...

[Harry D]

She came back the next morning and saw the corpse of the woman, panicked and left in a hurry. As far as I remember there's a witness who saw her that morning, no?

Yes, there were several witnesses who claimed to see her that morning, but eyewitness testimony is notoriously unreliable. Either that, or MJK was killed later than believed. The victim was murdered in MJK's room, MJK was never seen again, no alternative was identified, therefore the logical conclusion is that the Miller's Court victim was MJK.

[Sam Flynn]

We all know Joe identified Mary, by hair, ears, eyes, whatever.

Thinking of the horrific sight that must have been before him, is it possible that (if he believed it was Mary) Joe would have said anything to avoid being asked to take a second look.

So in his own mind he is convinced it's Mary, barely looks, says "Yep it's her"

"How do you recognise her" police ask.

first thing he thinks of "Her hair (or ear) and eyes.

It's more than likely that her hair, reported by other witnesses to have been one of Mary's distinctive features, was enough to clinch the identification at first glance.

[Robert]

Joe was aware of Harvey, and he had complained about Mary taking in prostitutes, I think he'd have been looking hard, hoping that the murdered woman was someone else.

[Pcdunn]

That's exactly what I've been on about from the very beginning. I'm glad you two share my view.

What I think happened is that she did lend her place to another female. She came back the next morning and saw the corpse of the woman, panicked and left in a hurry. As far as I remember there's a witness who saw her that morning, no?

Right, Jaden, and I do thank you, as your posts helped me think in this direction. Yes, two people claimed to have seen MJK alive the following morning, so it is possible.

[Pcdunn]

Yes, but, here's a thought...

Yes, there were several witnesses who claimed to see her that morning, but eyewitness testimony is notoriously unreliable. Either that, or MJK was killed later than believed. The victim was murdered in MJK's room, MJK was never seen again, no alternative was identified, therefore the logical conclusion is that the Miller's Court victim was MJK.

... If MJK has not been identified in the historic vital records prior to her being in Miller's Court, and no record of her by that name exists in the vital records elsewhere afterwards, perhaps "Mary Jeanette Kelly" was a false identity all along. So we may never really know who she was, nor who was killed in her place (if it was another).

[Sam Flynn]

perhaps "Mary Jeanette Kelly" was a false identity all along.

Sadly, there's every likelihood that this was indeed the case.

[Harry D]

... If MJK has not been identified in the historic vital records prior to her being in Miller's Court, and no record of her by that name exists in the vital records elsewhere afterwards, perhaps "Mary Jeanette Kelly" was a false identity all along. So we may never really know who she was, nor who was killed in her place (if it was another).

So, instead of going to the police or contacting her loved ones, MJK allowed everyone to believe she was dead? And since both of the girls who had stayed at MJK's were traceable, who was the girl on the bed if not MJK?

[Robert]

Surely the police would have shown the clothes on the chair to Barnett (and perhaps more pertinently, to the women of the court). If these were identified as Mary's, then you have to ask : what woman would vanish leaving her clothes behind?

[Sam Flynn]

If these were identified as Mary's, then you have to ask : what woman would vanish leaving her clothes behind?

Lady Godiva?

I'll get me mantle...