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  • Stomach

    Thumbing through Paul Begg’s ‘Jack the Ripper the Uncensored facts’ I read that MJK was (supposedly) seen on the morning after her murder had taken place by at least two people, Maurice Lewis and friend, and Caroline Maxwell.
    Caroline Maxwell described how at 8.30 am MJK had told her ‘Oh I do feel bad, I have the horrors of drink upon me.’
    Caroline Maxwell suggests she have half a pint in the ‘Ringers’. MJK replied she had and had brought it all up again, nodding towards some vomit on the pavement.
    Part of the post mortom by Dr Bond reads, Rigor Mortis had set in but increased during the process of examination. From this it is difficult to say with any certainty the exact time that had elapsed since death as the period varies from six to twelve hours before rigidity sets in. The body was comparitively cold at two o’clock and the remains of a recent meal were found in the stomach and scattered about over the intestines.
    It was therefore pretty certain that the woman must have been dead about twelve hours and the partly digested food would indicate that death took place about three or four hours after food was taken, so one or two o’clock in the morning would be the probable time of the murder.’
    If the witness accounts were accurate and MJK had been sick, surely her stomach would be empty, that is taking into account that the Dr has his time of death right, or maybe it wasn’t the body of MJK?

  • #2
    Hi Normy and welcome to the Boards,

    This is of course one of many issues of controversy and much is uncertain, but most likely this was a case of mistaken identity by Caroline Maxwell. After all, she had only known the woman she assumed was Kelly for some time and only met her TWICE duing this period.

    Most likely the time of death occurred around 4am on November 9, which ties in with Bond's estimate of the death of death and also with the cries of 'murder' heard by two persons individually. But again, we are left to speculate here.

    All the best
    The Swedes are the Men that Will not Be Blamed for Nothing

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    • #3
      The major complication with relying on the evidence of food in the stomach is that we have no clue when Mary would have eaten last. She could, for example, very easily have had fish and chips in her room sitting there waiting to be eaten at any point during the night. If she was killed during the day she could have gone out and eaten food in the morning. Unless someone had been watching her nonstop to report when she did or did not eat something this whole line of argument doesn't seem to go anywhere.

      Dan Norder
      Ripper Notes: The International Journal for Ripper Studies
      Web site: www.RipperNotes.com - Email: dannorder@gmail.com

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      • #4
        And of course, one can't really rely on any medical estimation by the doctors of 1888 on the time of death simply because most of today's methods to establish it weren't as developed as they are today, and some of them didn't even exist.
        Even today, establishing time of death by food digesting or rigor mortis can be quite complicated since so many other factors have to be considered - and in 1888 things appear to have been even less sophisticated.

        All the best
        The Swedes are the Men that Will not Be Blamed for Nothing

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        • #5
          Hi
          Thanks for the replies.
          I was kind of working along the lines that if she was killed later than suspected and had been seen in the morning pointing out that she'd been sick. Would there have been anything in her stomach half digested. Indicating it might not have been her body.
          Anyway back with the thinking cap.

          Cheers.

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          • #6
            Originally posted by Normy View Post
            Hi
            Thanks for the replies.
            I was kind of working along the lines that if she was killed later than suspected and had been seen in the morning pointing out that she'd been sick. Would there have been anything in her stomach half digested. Indicating it might not have been her body.
            Anyway back with the thinking cap.

            Cheers.
            Using a witness statement and/or food found in MJKs stomach to conclude that it might not have been MJK seems a bit foolhardy dont you think?

            I havent found anything whatsoever in any "evidence" to indicate to me that it was not MJKs body in the bed.

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            • #7
              Hiya
              'Foolhardy' yeah probably, just pushing the possiblity that as more than 2 people saw her on the morning she was murdered the timing of her death might be questionable a this would also put into question the suspects seen with her on in the early hours. As for the food in the stomach, I just thought it was slightly interesting.
              What evidence is there that it was MJK? Hair colour?

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