Tabram and Kelly?

[Glenn Lauritz Andersson]

Hi RonnieKray,

I suggest you read the Martha Tabram thread "Ripper Victim?", where all this is being discussed and debated.

All the best

[RonnieKray]

Mary_Jane_Kelly, thank you for replying....you say her throat wasn't cut....Peter Sutcliffe used a lump of wood to insert into one of his victims but never did that with others.

Where does the notion come from that murderers follow a rigid pattern?

[Mary_Jane_Kelly]

i think that MJK was a ripper victim because it fits the other murders, she had her throat cut and had facial/body mutilations. but im not convinced that martha was a ripper victim because her throat was not cut, which is one of the main links between the ripper murders. but that is only my opinion.

---MJK---

[Glenn Lauritz Andersson]

Hi RonnieKray,

As you may have noticed, those debates have been raging on numerous diffrent threads devoted for each victim for quite some time and it would be difficult to continue that on yet another without uncecessary repetition.

Let's just say that we're not just talking about change of modus operandi here (as in the Sutcliffe example) but there are also other factors to consider. In kelly's case you also have to look at the victimology and the situation she lived in with two men in her closest circuits having probable motives for mer murder. Plus the fact that the massive overkill and destruction of the face fits the elemetns displayed in other interpersonal domestic homicide, where a personal aspect to the crime may be indicated.
But as I said, this has been debated to death on endless threads so I am not getting into it again.

All the best

[RonnieKray]

I have read on various posts the Murders of Tabram and kelly may not be the Rippers victims because the MO is different i.e. Tabram was stabbed rather than sliced and that two murder wepoens were involved.

I don't know if any of you have read anything about Peter Sutcliffe or visted the website where you can read word for word his confession?

He not only used different types of hammer, he used different knives, screwdrivers and killed both indoors and outside and went back to try to manipulate how one of his murders would be perceived when the body was found. He also killed non-prostitutes.

In the more recent spate of murders in Ipswich, Steve Wright killed and placed two bodies in water before getting even weirder by arranging the bodies in a cross style.

I have yet to see any rational reason to declare with any degree of certainty that these two murders Tabram and Kelly can be ruled out. Murderers do not stick rigidly to a pattern as somehow we have gotton the idea that they do!

Does anybody here have any evidence or opinions as to why both or either of these murders should not be linked to JTR victim list?