Berner St. 1909 Sun/Shadow Study

[richardh]

I've knocked out a shadow study for the 1909 Berner street photo in order to show that the cartwheel was indeed fastened to the wall overhanging the pavement. When I first looked at this image many years ago I assumed the cartwheel was attached to the Workingmen's Club wall. I think it's an easy mistake to make so I hope this little study helps others (like me) visualise the scene.

Here's the time-lapse:



And here's a pic of frame 33 showing very close shadow match with the photo (see red circles) and which I suggest demonstrates that this photo was taken around 11:15 am on that morning:



Ta

[Phil Carter]

Hello richardh,

Thank you :-) Most interesting :-)

regards


Phil

[GUT]

G'day Richard

As always well done.

However I have always wondered if that is a shadow, or is it decoration on the gate. Your demonstration seems to confirm it as a shadow.

[richardh]

Yep GUT I agree. I thought there was more going on with the gate. I'm adding one to the scene. I'll upload tomorrow.

thanks for comments all.

G'day Richard

As always well done.

However I have always wondered if that is a shadow, or is it decoration on the gate. Your demonstration seems to confirm it as a shadow.

[GUT]

Just to clarify I had considered that the vertical lines the shadow sits on may have been from a gate with the design of the cartwheel replicated on it.

However all the shadows, ie window, chimney and downpipe on the study match the photo perfectly as does the cartwheel. The only logical conclusion is that it a shadow

[richardh]

Okay, here's a new time-lapse and image showing the scene with the gate in place:



And frame 34 comparison (about 11:15 am)



Not exact scaling but the shadow study is correct - shadows are in all the right place.

[John Wheat]

To Richard excellent work as usual. Plus its good to see someone not going on about that bloody shawl.

[GUT]

Okay, here's a new time-lapse and image showing the scene with the gate in place:



And frame 34 comparison (about 11:15 am)



Not exact scaling but the shadow study is correct - shadows are in all the right place.

G'day Richard

It was close enough first time to persuade this little black duck.

[richardh]

I'm reconstructing Dutfield's yard:
This image shows the wooden steps to the rooms above the stable are positioned to the left (as you look from the gates toward it).

http://forum.casebook.org/attachment...8&d=1261096774

However all the depictions in illustrations show the steps on the right.
e.g:

http://www.casebook.org/forum/messages/4920/15110.jpg

and

http://wiki.casebook.org/images/thum...fieldsYard.jpg

can someone help me out?

thanks.
R

[GUT]

G'day Richard

I have no actual knowledge on it. I wonder where Jane got her info from, ie was it based on an earlier sketch? Also do you know when the earlier sketch was made, I'm a bit of a sucker for contemporaneous, but I'd also be more inclined to accept a sketch made at the scene than a map.

I know that's not much help.

[GUT]

Looking more closely I don't see how either Sketch fits the map. Where in the sketches is the courtyard to the right.

[richardh]

Here's another contemporary illustration showing the steps on the right:

[GUT]

Well based on that I'd go right, except where is the yard that the map shows between the buildings marked "D" and "Forge" in the sketch?

[richardh]

Well, I think the yard continues to the right of the steps - into an 'L' shape.

I would rather trust the Goad map BUT I think the map I linked in my first post is a Goad's map from 1899 so things might have been altered in the interim.

Well based on that I'd go right, except where is the yard that the map shows between the buildings marked "D" and "Forge" in the sketch?

[GUT]

Well, I think the yard continues to the right of the steps - into an 'L' shape.

I would rather trust the Goad map BUT I think the map I linked in my first post is a Goad's map from 1899 so things might have been altered in the interim.

That's what I was trying to get at, which is the closest in time. And I get your point about the courtyard, but I just can't figure where it fits among the buildings shown in the sketch, which causes me to worry about the sketch.

Yes if the map was 10 years later there may have been changes