Originally posted by Trevor Marriott
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Why No Stride Mutilations ?
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Last edited by Varqm; 07-07-2022, 09:17 AM.Clearly the first human laws (way older and already established) spawned organized religion's morality - from which it's writers only copied/stole,ex. you cannot kill,rob,steal (forced,it started civil society).
M. Pacana
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I reckon probably killed by the same man. Ultimately, it would be highly unusual for two men to be in broadly the same location at the same time cutting women's throats. I was under the impression that there was no definitive conclusion on whether or not the same knife was used during the other murders (as per doctors' statements). Ultimately, the cut to the throat was consistent with the other murders which to me speaks volumes. There are so many variables outside of the murderer's control that the murders were never going to display the same hallmarks, but the consistent cut/s to the throat is telling.
Assuming he did stop in Goulston Street to wipe his knife, it begs the question: why? There are all sorts of possibilities, and one is that perhaps he was heading back into the vicinity of the first murder and given he committed the first murder he was expecting a police search to be in operation.
In terms of timings and the like, as others have pointed out: at least some of the witnesses will have had their times wrong (for obvious reasons) and so I personally don't hang my hat on the times given. Dr Blackwell arrived at 1:16am, I think that can be taken as highly likely. I've always wondered whether it is reasonable to think that 16 minutes is sufficient time from the body being found to Dr Blackwell arriving and all of the activity in between, and as a result the body may have been found earlier.
As for there being no mutilations and whether or not Dutfield's Yard was too risky for him: I think this is a brazen opportunist of an individual who certainly took a risk with both Polly and Annie in terms of location, and he simply could not control who would turn the corner when. I would go with interrupted but not necessarily by Diemschutz.
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Originally posted by JeffHamm View PostHi Trevor,
And Chapman is the only one in a backyard, and Nicoles the furthest east, and Kelly the only one indoors, and Eddowes the only one in a square .... It's always possible to find something about a crime that is different from the others. They all have unique characteristics. Being south of Whitechapel Road just happens to be a unique aspect for Stride.
I think initially he is taking an opportunity wherever it is presented but veers away from that because experience is telling him he is not going to satisfy his lust by doing that.
Like you, I don't believe location points towards a different murderer.
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Originally posted by erobitha View PostAll based on a testimony of a man who has never been proven to exist.
No record exists of Israel Schwartz. The man who walked into give his statement to Abberline giving this name cannot be found in any record. Yet somehow a journalist in The Star found him (and his interpreter was home as well which was a tad fortunate). Swanson didn't have the right address. Who really was he and why should we believe him if we can't even find him? How do we know this is not a false statement?
I will say it again. Take Israel Schwartz out of the equation with all the things he supposedly saw and the timings. Then see how the scene plays out - it makes much more sense.
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To answer the OP's original question. Simply because he was interrupted. London was a busy city and it didn't stop at 1am. In fact with the exception of Mary Jane Kelly, all the canonical victims have an element of interruption in them if all the witnesses are to be believed.
Liz Stride's murder has all the elements of the JtR MO but not his signature. For another killer to have JtR's MO be hunting that exact same night, in that exact same area, within the hour, with the exact same victimology is quite a lot of coincidences, far far likely Strides and Eddowes had the same killer, but was interrupted with Stride and went on to kill another. We have modern documentation of serial killers doing this if their first attack does not go as planned and he does not gain the "satisfaction" required attacks again that same night, Ted Bundy for example has done this.
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Originally posted by Garza View PostTo answer the OP's original question. Simply because he was interrupted. London was a busy city and it didn't stop at 1am. In fact with the exception of Mary Jane Kelly, all the canonical victims have an element of interruption in them if all the witnesses are to be believed.
Liz Stride's murder has all the elements of the JtR MO but not his signature. For another killer to have JtR's MO be hunting that exact same night, in that exact same area, within the hour, with the exact same victimology is quite a lot of coincidences, far far likely Strides and Eddowes had the same killer, but was interrupted with Stride and went on to kill another. We have modern documentation of serial killers doing this if their first attack does not go as planned and he does not gain the "satisfaction" required attacks again that same night, Ted Bundy for example has done this.
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Originally posted by Newbie View PostThroat slashing seems like such an unusual choice in a dispute fueled by drunken rage and frustration: its not punishment, its a quick death.
"The full picture always needs to be given. When this does not happen, we are left to make decisions on insufficient information." - Christer Holmgren
"Unfortunately, when one becomes obsessed by a theory, truth and logic rarely matter." - Steven Blomer
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