The Murder of Elizabeth Stride

[Tom_Wescott]

Was amazed at how short Berner Street actually is, thought it would be twice as long for some reason.

Hi Garza. Are you referring to the entirety of Berner Street (i.e. from Commercial to Backchurch lane) or just the part that runs from Commercial Rd to Fairclough St.?

Yours truly,

Tom Wescott

[Garza]

We all seem to have ignored your first Casebook post, which you made some thirty days ago.

I would have gladly answered such a simple question, had I seen the post.


Northwestern Corner of Fairclough Street / Berner Street, Parish of St. George in the East (Click Image, to Enlarge in flickr)

I visited the Jack the Ripper locations for the first time in January.

Was amazed at how short Berner Street actually is, thought it would be twice as long for some reason.

[Colin Roberts]

Forgive me if the answer to what I'm asking is already established and also if I'm posting in the wrong thread but this is my first post and there's an awful lot of material in these message boards to wade through. My question is, does anyone know for certain the exact location of the entrance to Dutfield's Yard? I have spent some time recently wandering around what was Berner Street and on the East side there is only one three storey building that looks as if it may date from the 1888 period. Although it looks quite similar to the one shown in the 1909 picture (the IWEC) and the contemporary artists impressions it clearly had another similar building standing on its left as you look at it which has now been demolished so it can't be. Also there are decorative courses of blue bricks set into the red which don't show up in the 1909 photograph. My best guess is that the IWEC must have been more or less where the North end of Basil House is now IF it was on the East side of the street. Can anyone enlighten me?

We all seem to have ignored your first Casebook post, which you made some thirty days ago.

I would have gladly answered such a simple question, had I seen the post.


Northwestern Corner of Fairclough Street / Berner Street, Parish of St. George in the East (Click Image, to Enlarge in flickr)

[Prosector]

Dutfield's Yard

Forgive me if the answer to what I'm asking is already established and also if I'm posting in the wrong thread but this is my first post and there's an awful lot of material in these message boards to wade through. My question is, does anyone know for certain the exact location of the entrance to Dutfield's Yard? I have spent some time recently wandering around what was Berner Street and on the East side there is only one three storey building that looks as if it may date from the 1888 period. Although it looks quite similar to the one shown in the 1909 picture (the IWEC) and the contemporary artists impressions it clearly had another similar building standing on its left as you look at it which has now been demolished so it can't be. Also there are decorative courses of blue bricks set into the red which don't show up in the 1909 photograph. My best guess is that the IWEC must have been more or less where the North end of Basil House is now IF it was on the East side of the street. Can anyone enlighten me?
W

[Ben]

Thanks, Tom. Always good to have a break from Miller's Court occasionally!

All the best,
Ben

[Jeff Leahy]

With all the weird ideas being bandied about lately regarding the Berner Street cast, for all I know the latest interpretation puts Pipeman across from Dutfield's Yard with a semi-blind Schwartz not seeing him until his hat caught fire in the match flame.

Yours truly,

Tom Wescott

While I'd agree with you...we have two serious Ripperologists with different view pionts...

And given that, it should be considered seriously

Pirate

[Tom_Wescott]

That's an interesting thought, Ben. One I hadn't considered before. Good to see you on a Stride thread!

Yours truly,

Tom Wescott

[Ben]

Absolutely, Caz. And what better inspiration for the physical appearance of Astrakhan man than the pesky Jew who interrupted him at Berner Steet?

[caz]

The difference being that nobody reported seeing a theatrically dressed Jewish-looking man skulking opposite Dutfields Yards shortly before Stride was murdered, and Schwartz didn't come forward as soon as this detail was divulged at the inquest.

But back to Stride.

Unless...?

Saw this and suddenly recalled that Schwartz himself was described by someone as having a 'theatrical' appearance. A theatrically dressed Jewish-looking man, no less - opposite Dutfields Yard shortly before Stride was murdered.

The plots sicken...

...and die.

Love,

Caz
X

[Fleetwood Mac]

I thought he was at the Nelson, but each to his own I guess...

Regards, Jon S.

70/30 in favour of The Nelson side.

'On crossing the road.....'. This suggests present tense. In other words, he's crossing; he's making his way over.

From that point, 'the opposite side of the road' could mean either side.

But, when pressed, I'd go for the Nelson side, because 'on crossing' suggests it's more likely he has crossed than it is he is beginning to cross, and as he's relaying Schwartz's account he's likely speaking from Schwartz's position.

[DVV]

Given a choice between Schwartz and Hutchinson, I'd go 500/1 Schwartz; Hutchinson non runner.

How childish. When Schwartz will become a popular suspect, you'll call him 'non runner', that's it ?

[Wickerman]

With all the weird ideas being bandied about lately regarding the Berner Street cast, for all I know the latest interpretation puts Pipeman across from Dutfield's Yard with a semi-blind Schwartz not seeing him until his hat caught fire in the match flame.

Yours truly,

Tom Wescott

I thought he was at the Nelson, but each to his own I guess...

Regards, Jon S.

[Ben]

The difference being that nobody reported seeing a theatrically dressed Jewish-looking man skulking opposite Dutfields Yards shortly before Stride was murdered, and Schwartz didn't come forward as soon as this detail was divulged at the inquest.

But back to Stride.

Unless...?

[Fleetwood Mac]

Hello Mac. Funny you should mention that. There is an old thread "Is Schwartz a Hassidic Hutchinson?"

Cheers.
LC

Was Schwartz the well dressed clerk who turned up for questioning looking like Quentin Crisp? He was hardly going to present himself in killer garb, and the old street vendor fellas used to sell a comedy, fake beard with every second bunch of grapes.

Given a choice between Schwartz and Hutchinson, I'd go 500/1 Schwartz; Hutchinson non runner.

[lynn cates]

S & H

Hello Mac. Funny you should mention that. There is an old thread "Is Schwartz a Hassidic Hutchinson?"

Cheers.
LC