Those Damned Cachous

[The Good Michael]

Hello Errata. Thanks.

"So was she conceivably in one of these neighborhoods?"

No, most certainly not. The inquest testimony brought that out.

Lynn,

One yard does not a neighborhood make, but your point is taken. In the neighborhood, prior to the gates of Dutfield's Yard, this most certainly was such a neighborhood.

Mike

[Tom_Wescott]

Why wouldn't Stride have a younger boyfriend? I realize you prefer your own speculation, but there is no reason I can see why she wouldn't, or couldn't.

My 'speculation' as you called it is preferable, that's why I prefer it. There's absolutely zero evidence to suggest Stride had a younger boyfriend, let alone Morris Eagle, who was inside at the time she was murdered by another man outside in a dark passageway.

Yours truly,

Tom Wescott

[RockySullivan]

I still feel like there could be a connection to the lipski murder. Why would lipski pour acid in his mouth if he was the killer? And why did that damned man yell lipski?! Was lipski really written with the pinchin torso...? It's right near the spot where pipeman chased Schwartz too. How much of a coincidence? Far too much

[lynn cates]

drawings

Hello Tom. If their drawings were accurate, it seems both Eygle and Dimshits were rather slight of build?

Cheers.
LC

[lynn cates]

slur

Hello Rocky.

"And why did that damned man yell Lipski?!"

I would suggest that a racial slur, aimed at Jews, would enhance the "point" that it was NOT a Jewish club member who killed Stride.

Cheers.
LC

[Jon Guy]

Hi Jon, Stride had recently been in the Berner Street area, visiting Tiger Bay, and had also been in Hanbury Street.

That`s interesting, Tom, I hadn`t heard that before.
Do you have any more details on the above ?

[Rosella]

I still feel like there could be a connection to the lipski murder. Why would lipski pour acid in his mouth if he was the killer? And why did that damned man yell lipski?! Was lipski really written with the pinchin torso...? It's right near the spot where pipeman chased Schwartz too. How much of a coincidence? Far too much

Why would Lipski swallow acid? Perhaps because he knew the game was up and he faced a public trial and the hangman's rope. There have been several cases of killers who tried to evade arrest by attempting suicide.

[Michael W Richards]

My 'speculation' as you called it is preferable, that's why I prefer it. There's absolutely zero evidence to suggest Stride had a younger boyfriend, let alone Morris Eagle, who was inside at the time she was murdered by another man outside in a dark passageway.

Yours truly,

Tom Wescott

The speculation you prefer does not account for the fact that without Israel Schwartz, Liz was not visible to Fanny when she stepped out to her door, off and on, from 12:30 until 12:50, when she remained at her doorstep until 1am. I know you believe there was indeed a BSM and Pipeman on the streets unseen by anyone else aside from Schwartz,.. who did not appear at the Inquest nor had his story entered as evidence during it, but it remains a fact that Fanny didn't see or hear anyone during that time period she was at the door sporadically, she didn't see Morris or Louis arrive, and she surely didn't see Louis arrive at 1am.

What you ignore constantly is the fact that at least 3 witnesses, 2 club..one from outside the club, put themselves standing by the dead woman around the time Morris says he entered the passageway, and around 15 minutes before Louis says he arrived.

There is a single witness here that has any corroboration by statements given by others unconnected to her, that's Fanny. She saw the young couple, and she saw Goldstein. All other "corroborative" statements are given by the club staff, the people who were trying to protect the club and its members from suspicion. People with motives to lie.

If you choose to base your "speculation" on the accounts without any known proof of authenticity, that's up to you, but based on accounts that do have unconnected corroboration, the street was "deserted", meaning that Liz was probably already in the passageway at 12:40-12:45..thereby making Laves and Eagles statements suspect.

By the 3 witnesses who corroborate each others timing, seemingly without discussing the matter amongst themselves beforehand, Liz was already with her killer in the passageway when Eagle says he arrived, and cut and dying 10-15 minutes before 1am.

So, your preferred version of events is contrary to 3 witnesses without any responsibilities in the clubs operation, and Fanny, and is supported by statements from anarchists with a lot to lose and zero corroboration from outside sources.

If you find that preferable, then fine, I believe my speculation is founded using all the known data, not just the non-validated "facts" of Israel, Louis, Joe and Morris's statements.

It also doesn't explain why she still held cashous after being cut.


Cheers

[Tom_Wescott]

That`s interesting, Tom, I hadn`t heard that before.
Do you have any more details on the above ?

Hi Jon. I'm going from my memory here, which isn't always so good. But I believe I published this stuff some years ago in my 'Exonerating Michael Kidney' essay, which is in the Dissertations section here at Casebook.

Yours truly,

Tom Wescott

[Tom_Wescott]

If you find that preferable, then fine, I believe my speculation is founded using all the known data, not just the non-validated "facts" of Israel, Louis, Joe and Morris's statements.

All the known data points to Morris Eagle and Stride having a secret relationship? There must be a butt load of data out there known only to yourself.

But if Stride was dating Morris, then who were all those men she was seen canoodling with while Morris was stuck at the club with his other, younger girlfriend?

Yours truly,

Tom Wescott

[RockySullivan]

There are places in the city where I assume any woman walking around is a prostitute. And I'm not often wrong. And the few times I have been wrong, they have borne me no ill will for making that assumption. Probably because I got the one woman in 300 who isn't hooking.

Also, If I'm in China Town in New York, I assume that any Asian person behind the counter is Chinese. I don't ask people if there are Koreans. Maybe there are, but I'm not a bad person for assuming that non caucasians in China Town are Chinese.

So was she conceivably in one of these neighborhoods? It doesn't mean she was soliciting, but it might mean people would assume she was.

Hmm...

[c.d.]

Hello Michael,

For about the ten millionth time no one knows why Schwartz did not appear at the inquest. It could have been a completely innocuous reason. Therefore, constantly citing it does nothing to bolster your argument.

c.d.

[c.d.]

Hello Rocky.

"And why did that damned man yell Lipski?!"

I would suggest that a racial slur, aimed at Jews, would enhance the "point" that it was NOT a Jewish club member who killed Stride.

Cheers.
LC

Well, if the B.S. man assumed Schwartz was Jewish and wanted to hurl an insult or more likely a threat, Lipski would seem a good choice although that fairly simple explanation lacks the panache of a conspiracy theory.

c.d.

[Tom_Wescott]

I don't understand Lynn's logic, since the club members, in spite of their heritage, were about as anti-Jew as one could get (pre-Nazi, that is).

Yours truly,

Tom Wescott

[The Good Michael]

I don't understand Lynn's logic, since the club members, in spite of their heritage, were about as anti-Jew as one could get (pre-Nazi, that is).

Jewish ethnically, but not spiritually. The insult would, seemingly, apply to the ethnicity.

Mike