Those Damned Cachous

[Wickerman]

Blood was on the inside & outside of her hand.

[Errata]

Hello Errata.

"What if she threw a punch? That might change the dynamic quite a bit. I mean, if she slugged somebody during some conflict and walked away, that might be terribly enraging to someone."

With cachous in hand?

Cheers.
LC

Not slugged someone in defense of her life, but in an argument shortly preceding death. Not immediately preceding death. Within half an hour say. I meant to say. I see I did not.

[Errata]

Blood was on the inside & outside of her hand.

Which does happen when you hit someone in the nose. The blood trickles between the knuckles and onto the palm. And anyway, blood on the inside of the hand is easy to explain. It's the outside that's odd. There no reason for it to be drips from the knife. Then there would be blood spots on the front of her dress. There were none.

I'm not saying this is what happened. I'm saying it's possible. It does explain one mystery (not all). But if it were true, it would certainly change how we see her death. If it were true, she either slugged Jack, who was so fast and sneaky he got these women on the ground with a peep from them, or she punched someone else. So would we think it was likely she punched someone in the face and then before she could clean up got killed by Jack, or would we think it more likely that the person she hit killed her?

Since we have no idea what happened that night, I'm throwing out a scenario. If this were true, then what conclusions would we draw? No different than if she were coming out of the bathroom, or if she was waiting for a cleaning job.

But for the love of god don't get me started on the flowers.

[lynn cates]

clarification

Hello Errata. Thanks.

Ah, now I see what you are about.

Could be.

Cheers.
LC

[Tom_Wescott]

Hi Errata, but that's not what happened. No trickling.

Yours truly,

Tom Wescott

[Bridewell]

Hello Colin. Meet you half way--it was NOT Kidney.

Cheers.
LC

Okay, I'll bite. I don't think it was your man either, so who do you have in mind?

[Michael W Richards]

Why in the world would she dress up for a cleaning assignment? It's not like she got the cleaning assignment after undergoing a series of grueling interviews and wanted to continue to impress. Plus as Lynn always says the club members didn't have a pot to pee in. If it was her job to clean, why would they care how she was dressed?

Why not tell the police that Liz was there to clean? That makes a lot more sense than coming up with the B.S. man story.

c.d.

First off not ALL the attendees or members would necessarily be dirt poor....just the ones that were being recruited. Charwomen working in decent homes would wear a uniform, and I would think that anyone applying for a position, or being referred for one, would present themselves in a respectable way for that meeting, and if she is there to clean it would pay better than cleaning a single room...there is also the possibility that she was waiting for a man, a prearranged date....and we do in fact have someone who arrives back at the club after taking his (first?) date home at a time when Liz Stride must have been in the immediate area...yet he doesnt remember seeing anyone. Not even lying in the passageway...didnt recall it. Maybe she came to clean for the Morris family...and she wasnt told that his speech had been cancelled that night due to threatened disruptions.

Your question......Why not tell the police she was there to clean? No problem, and then how do they explain the fact that she is murdered almost on the side doorstep of their club.... exactly how? Since we have club witnesses that say only club attendees were still on the property. Do they invoke a gentile phantom menace, a fella that slips into the picture without anyone seeing him, and leaves without being seen, after cutting a woman once and dashing?

Well,...maybe they did just that....Sunday evening via translator.

Cheers cd

[lynn cates]

suspect

Hello Colin. Thanks.

Actually, I have no real suspect--although I wish I knew a bit more about Lave.

Cheers.
LC

[c.d.]

Hello Lynn,

Liz was not killed inside the club. So there would be no problem saying she was there to clean. Club members would have no control over what happened to her outside the club.

c.d.

[Michael W Richards]

Hello Lynn,

Liz was not killed inside the club. So there would be no problem saying she was there to clean. Club members would have no control over what happened to her outside the club.

c.d.

If I may cd, there is a huge difference where Liz was killed. Had she been killed on the street just outside the gates...(which is possibly what Israel is suggesting with BSM bending down to reach to her)...no issues. They would have little to worry about had she been killed there. But she wasnt.

Lets use a hypothetical I offered a few times before....if Liz had been seen in the passageway by someone hired as security for the night, also in the passageway, he might not have known if she was waiting for someone, or a cleaning job. He might have thought she was spying on the club, listening to the talk from the windows above, or through the open door. Police did hire Unfortunates to do just that.

One last thing.....Liz might have spoken some Hebrew, learned "while at work among the Jews".....and if so, she might have been uniquely able to listen in to the conversations. The way it was described...."at work among the Jews", seems to me to imply more than one Jewish client.

Cheers

[lynn cates]

And so . . .

Hello CD. Thanks.

"Liz was not killed inside the club."

Indeed.

"So there would be no problem saying she was there to clean."

You mean for the club? Very well.

"Club members would have no control over what happened to her outside the club."

Agreed. And?

Cheers.
LC

[lynn cates]

security

Hello Mike. Do we know historically that the club EVER hired security people?

Cheers.
LC

[Errata]

One last thing.....Liz might have spoken some Hebrew, learned "while at work among the Jews".....and if so, she might have been uniquely able to listen in to the conversations. The way it was described...."at work among the Jews", seems to me to imply more than one Jewish client.

Cheers

Almost never happens. Never mind that until the formation of Israel, Hebrew was a liturgical language. Like Latin. No one spoke it as their language. Russian, Polish, yes, probably Yiddish. But not Hebrew.

Never mind that Westerners have a hell of a time learning how to speak Hebrew. And it's impossible to learn it just by hearing it occasionally. It's completely foreign. Different sounds, different structure, different alphabet. Most people can't even distinguish individual words in a sentence.

One now dead dialect of Yiddish on the other hand is stupid easy if you know German. Which being Swedish, Stride may have had some German. But by far the most popular dialect of Yiddish mixes Hebrew and Baltic languages. Lithuanian, Ukranian, etc. Less likely to be known. And Yiddish is very flexible so someone working for Yiddish speakers may never hear the same vowel pronunciation twice.

[Wickerman]

Which does happen when you hit someone in the nose.

It also happens when a policeman feels the blood around the body to see if it has congealed, then takes her pulse, as P.C. Lamb claimed to do.

[c.d.]

Hello CD. Thanks.

"Liz was not killed inside the club."

Indeed.

"So there would be no problem saying she was there to clean."

You mean for the club? Very well.

"Club members would have no control over what happened to her outside the club."

Agreed. And?

Cheers.
LC

Hello Lynn,

...and so there would be no need for producing Schwartz with a made up story. You have given the police a very simple and reasonable explanation for why Liz was waiting outside the club and in doing so you have eliminated any personal, i.e., romantic connection with anyone associated with the club. This was not the first murder that Autumn so I don't see how the club becomes so immediately suspect that it felt the need to create some sort of bogus story.

c.d.