Those Damned Cachous

[lynn cates]

Q & A

Hello Rocky.

"Would prostitutes wear a flower pinned on their chest as a way to attract more johns?"

Well, here are two quick questions in reply.

1. How much would the floral arrangement cost?

2. What was the going rate for a knee tremblor with a drab?

Cheers.
LC

[lynn cates]

neighbourhood

Hello Jon. Thanks.

"If the man was drunk, why would he wait for an invitation?"

So he assaults any unescorted woman?

"I'm assuming such a character will interrupt the couple if he recognised Stride as a local prostitute, and decided to reprimand her on the spot.'

Perhaps. But local? Berner was not her neighbourhood.

"There are a few aspects of this case I am not sure about, so I don't buy wholly into any explanation at the moment."

Only a few? (heh-heh) I'll join you.

"The biggest annoyance for me is the description of the man she was with at the Bricklayers Arms."

Indeed. And the difference in HER nose?

"I'm suspicious that this was not the last she saw of him."

The mousy, nervous lad? Perhaps.

Cheers.
LC

[Jon Guy]

"I'm assuming such a character will interrupt the couple if he recognised Stride as a local prostitute, and decided to reprimand her on the spot.'

Perhaps. But local? Berner was not her neighbourhood.

Oh, and I thought that Stride had until a few months previously had lived for a number of years in Devonshire Street, just up the road from Berner Street.

[Tom_Wescott]

Hi Jon, Stride had recently been in the Berner Street area, visiting Tiger Bay, and had also been in Hanbury Street.

Yours truly,

Tom Wescott

[Wickerman]

Hello Jon. Thanks.

"If the man was drunk, why would he wait for an invitation?"

So he assaults any unescorted woman?

Is he drunk, or just walks with a limp?
The assumption is, he is a drunk. Drunks are known to accost strangers, and if he was not fond of prostitutes, he may try to move them on?

Perhaps. But local? Berner was not her neighbourhood.

It may not have been his, either.

"The biggest annoyance for me is the description of the man she was with at the Bricklayers Arms."

Indeed. And the difference in HER nose?

"I'm suspicious that this was not the last she saw of him."

The mousy, nervous lad? Perhaps.

Sutcliffe looked like a wimp.

[lynn cates]

It's a beatiful day in the neighbourhood.

Hello Jon. Thanks.

My point was in his recognising her as a prostitute. Some give me to understand that unescorted woman = prostitute.

Regarding neighbourhood: My point is that there is no reason to assume they were from the same one. So it is not clear whether they knew one another. And if they WERE from the same, it does not follow that it was the neighbourhood where she solicited--if she did at all.

My last point regarded a possible wrong identification of Liz.

But, for all that, the BSM story might be true. If it were, it would greatly facilitate my overall theory.

Cheers.
LC

[Wickerman]

Hello Jon. Thanks.

My point was in his recognising her as a prostitute. Some give me to understand that unescorted woman = prostitute.

Regarding neighbourhood: My point is that there is no reason to assume they were from the same one. So it is not clear whether they knew one another. And if they WERE from the same, it does not follow that it was the neighbourhood where she solicited--if she did at all.

My last point regarded a possible wrong identification of Liz.

But, for all that, the BSM story might be true. If it were, it would greatly facilitate my overall theory.

Cheers.
LC

I wish I felt confident about anything in the Stride case to have a theory...

[Tom_Wescott]

Stride was a number of things. One of those things was prostitute.

Yours truly,

Tom Wescott

[Michael W Richards]

Hello Mike. Why would someone clean with a flower pinned to her breast?

Cheers.
LC

Lets suppose that the job was facilitated by a client of hers...someone who could afford to hire a cleaning or char woman was better off financially than 90% of the attendees...whose to say she didn't regularly wear nice clothes and a flower arrangement when working in that kind of circumstance Lynn?

Yes, I agree with the subtext, she likely had a desire to present herself well which could mean "date",... and we know that when Eagle and Lave are in the same place at the same time and don't see anything even each other, that Liz wasnt already in that passageway, based on Fannys contention that she was at her door off an on until 12:50 and saw virtually no-one...when she was at it continuously until 1am.

Eagle say he entered the passageway at 12:40, Lave says he was at the gates looking out at the street at 12:40...and Liz is probably in the same small space at that time...yet both men do not see each other let alone anyone else....just like Fanny doesn't see or hear Louis between 12:50 and 1am...even though he would have had to pass right by her door based on his own statement.

Seems disturbingly obvious to me....even though many are oblivious to the truth... that Morris, Joseph, and Louis all seem to have made statements that are inherently flawed and without any corroboration....the club principals in this saga with the most to lose...and Fanny and 3 other witnesses make statements that are corroborated, the 3 others all corroborate independently each other, without conspiracy, or any threat or possible gain based on the outcome of any investigation.

People also seem to miss the fact that she had been getting regular char work...which would greatly reduce the possibility that she would need to solicit at all. Added to her "nice evening wear", mints for her breath and a nice flower arrangement on her breast, and a single cut.... its clear she was not soliciting any more than she was robbed or killed by a Ripper.

But people like to imagine they know better than whats on paper.

Cheers Lynn

[Errata]

Hello Jon. Thanks.

My point was in his recognising her as a prostitute. Some give me to understand that unescorted woman = prostitute.

Cheers.
LC

There are places in the city where I assume any woman walking around is a prostitute. And I'm not often wrong. And the few times I have been wrong, they have borne me no ill will for making that assumption. Probably because I got the one woman in 300 who isn't hooking.

Also, If I'm in China Town in New York, I assume that any Asian person behind the counter is Chinese. I don't ask people if there are Koreans. Maybe there are, but I'm not a bad person for assuming that non caucasians in China Town are Chinese.

So was she conceivably in one of these neighborhoods? It doesn't mean she was soliciting, but it might mean people would assume she was.

[lynn cates]

uniform

Hello Mike. Thanks.

Well, maybe a maid's uniform, but a flower?

Cheers.
LC

[lynn cates]

no

Hello Errata. Thanks.

"So was she conceivably in one of these neighborhoods?"

No, most certainly not. The inquest testimony brought that out.

Cheers.
LC

[Michael W Richards]

There are places in the city where I assume any woman walking around is a prostitute. And I'm not often wrong. And the few times I have been wrong, they have borne me no ill will for making that assumption. Probably because I got the one woman in 300 who isn't hooking.

Also, If I'm in China Town in New York, I assume that any Asian person behind the counter is Chinese. I don't ask people if there are Koreans. Maybe there are, but I'm not a bad person for assuming that non caucasians in China Town are Chinese.

So was she conceivably in one of these neighborhoods? It doesn't mean she was soliciting, but it might mean people would assume she was.

Based on the above in bold...and what follows... I can now see why you make some of the comments that you do. You assume with very broad strokes.

To Lynn...for the record I believe its more probable that she was meeting a man there, someone from the club, and since she likely was in the passageway when Eagle entered it, and the fact that he and Lave both said they saw no-one, I think it may have been Morris.

Re-read his statement, curious that someone who claimed to be squeamish at the sight of blood would run "pell-mell" down the stairs to see some of it...or did he just think it may have been the woman waiting for him?

Cheers

[Tom_Wescott]

Based on the above in bold...and what follows... I can now see why you make some of the comments that you do. You assume with very broad strokes.

To Lynn...for the record I believe its more probable that she was meeting a man there, someone from the club, and since she likely was in the passageway when Eagle entered it, and the fact that he and Lave both said they saw no-one, I think it may have been Morris.

Re-read his statement, curious that someone who claimed to be squeamish at the sight of blood would run "pell-mell" down the stairs to see some of it...or did he just think it may have been the woman waiting for him?

Cheers

It's doubtful the middle-aged Stride would have been there to meet Morris Eagle, a young man in his 20s who had just walked his girlfriend home. However, I think it's possible (only possible, mind you) that Eagle was BS Man and rudely moved Stride out of the way of his entrance into the gate. This might explain his reaction upon seeing the dead woman in the yard. Or, it might simply have been the blood, keeping in mind that Stride's face was not visible in the position her body was found it. This is assuming the men were truthful when they said they never touched the body. But that's another can of worms.

Yours truly,

Tom Wescott

[Michael W Richards]

It's doubtful the middle-aged Stride would have been there to meet Morris Eagle, a young man in his 20s who had just walked his girlfriend home. However, I think it's possible (only possible, mind you) that Eagle was BS Man and rudely moved Stride out of the way of his entrance into the gate. This might explain his reaction upon seeing the dead woman in the yard. Or, it might simply have been the blood, keeping in mind that Stride's face was not visible in the position her body was found it. This is assuming the men were truthful when they said they never touched the body. But that's another can of worms.

Yours truly,

Tom Wescott

Why wouldn't Stride have a younger boyfriend? I realize you prefer your own speculation, but there is no reason I can see why she wouldn't, or couldn't.