How Could Jack Have Learned That Eddowes Knew His Identity?

[Scott Nelson]

Dave, you have yet to explain how Sutton got her body from #6 Mitre Street to the corner of Mitre Square.

[JeffHamm]

It seems to me that if Kate, rightly or wrongly, thought she knew JtR then this would have been something she and John Kelly would have discussed. It seems rather unlikely that he would not have been aware of whom she suspected, or at least aware that she thought she knew who he was. And yet, there is nothing to indicate that John Kelly passed any such information on to the police. The idea that she actually knew who JtR was, divulged this information to other people such that JtR would become aware of it, and yet nobody thought to go to the police and tell them whom she suspected seems ... unlikely to me. Moreover, it seems rather implausible that she would agree to meet with him, alone, in the dark, in the seclusion of Mitre Square.

So, even if we think Kate thought she knew who JtR was, given she was killed by him, it would suggest her belief was incorrect. But regardless, it seems a rather large stretch that she would not have told Kidney whom she suspected. Even if one allows for that to be "her secret", the idea that she would not have immediately gone to the police upon her return from hop picking (in an attempt to collect the public reward money) stretches credibility in my opinion.

- Jeff

[DJA]

Dave, you have yet to explain how Sutton got her body from #6 Mitre Street to the corner of Mitre Square.

Out the back window and through the gate.

[DJA]

It seems to me that if Kate, rightly or wrongly, thought she knew JtR then this would have been something she and John Kelly would have discussed. It seems rather unlikely that he would not have been aware of whom she suspected, or at least aware that she thought she knew who he was. And yet, there is nothing to indicate that John Kelly passed any such information on to the police. The idea that she actually knew who JtR was, divulged this information to other people such that JtR would become aware of it, and yet nobody thought to go to the police and tell them whom she suspected seems ... unlikely to me. Moreover, it seems rather implausible that she would agree to meet with him, alone, in the dark, in the seclusion of Mitre Square.

So, even if we think Kate thought she knew who JtR was, given she was killed by him, it would suggest her belief was incorrect. But regardless, it seems a rather large stretch that she would not have told Kidney whom she suspected. Even if one allows for that to be "her secret", the idea that she would not have immediately gone to the police upon her return from hop picking (in an attempt to collect the public reward money) stretches credibility in my opinion.

- Jeff

There was no reward.
She suspected Kidney?

[DJA]

So, even if we think Kate thought she knew who JtR was, given she was killed by him, it would suggest her belief was incorrect.

- Jeff

Beggars belief.

[Wickerman]

There was no reward.
...

Hi Dave, Sam Montagu offered a £100 reward on Sept. 10th, in a letter to Warren.

[c.d.]

Not necessarily a huge reward but I would expect the police to have money to pay informants.

c.d.

[Wickerman]

Now Kate parted from John Kelly at 2pm on Saturday 29th, the following day.John Kelly later claimed she told him she was going to her daughters in Bermondsey to try to cadge money,....

She was carted off to Bishopsgate Police Station,let out at 1.00am and apparently was last seen turning towards Houndsditch,presumably making her way back to Houndsditch, Aldgate.
What was the big attraction for her there?Why Aldgate?And what was she doing with herself those six hours from 2pm until 8.30 pm.....

For what it's worth, I think Kate decided to head to Bermondsey, to get some money.
The nearest bridge to cross the river was at the end of Bishopsgate.
Kate turned left out of the station, in my view, to head for the bridge, not towards Houndsditch.
As stated, she intended to go to Bermondsey, she took the quickest route as Tower Bridge did not exist.

[spyglass]

I personally don't think that Eddowes actually knew Jack's identity. But if she had been fairly certain she knew this would be valuable information. Wouldn't she have wanted to keep that to herself so no one else could claim the reward? So how does Jack hear of this? I suppose she could have mentioned a name to her friends and Jack might have overheard their conversation in a pub. Would she have been so foolish as to actually confront Jack with her allegation? Seems highly doubtful.

So how did Jack learn of this?

c.d.

Rumours and hearsay were probably rife..."someone I know was told by a friend of a friend " etc , or she simply was convinced she knew who it was without any evidence.
I think I'm right in thinking that MJK had said the same thing to Barnett....strange that the two Final victims, linked by certain coincidences both claim they knew.

[DJA]

Hi Dave, Sam Montagu offered a £100 reward on Sept. 10th, in a letter to Warren.

HI Jon.Montagu tried to offer a reward,however the Home Office did not accept the offer.

[JeffHamm]

...
...rather large stretch that she would not have told Kidney whom she suspected. ...

That should read Kelly, not Kidney.

- Jeff

[c.d.]

That should read Kelly, not Kidney.

- Jeff

That she would have said something to her husband is a good point.

c.d.

[JeffHamm]

That she would have said something to her husband is a good point.

c.d.

Yah, and I would have thought they would have gone to the police immediately after returning from hop picking.

Do we know when they would have left London for that? It seems to me that they probably left before the Nichols murder, but I don't know the time frame over which hop harvesting would occur. If she wasn't in London at that time, though, while it would be likely she would have heard of the murders, it seems unlikely she would know who JtR was. Of course, she still might have some suspicions about someone for whatever reason. Either way, if they were out of town at the start of the series, the likelihood she hadn't mentioned it to Kelly seems vanishingly small to me.

- Jeff

[DJA]

Eddowes left soon after Nichols moved next door to her on 24th August.

[GBinOz]

Yah, and I would have thought they would have gone to the police immediately after returning from hop picking.

- Jeff

Hi Jeff,

Might she have thought that she could attain more monetary gain from attempting to blackmail Jack? Met with him near where she was found drunk? She was supposedly penniless, so how did she afford the necessary Gin to achieve that level of drunkenness. Could Jack have notionally agreed to her demands and asked her to meet him later in the same place, which would explain why she headed that way instead of going home? When she returned, did Jack ask her what she had told police, and did she give her name, to which she may have replied "I told them my name was Nothing"? So Jack tells her he has the money and invites her to accompany him to where he has it stashed, fitting in with the story of a messenger boy seeing a couple depart from that location, with the man returning alone shortly after.

I note that it was claimed that Deeming had a letter that was purportedly from Kate, so perhaps they were acquainted. Dave's hypothesis regarding Sutton, which I find to be of interest, might also be considered as he might have persuaded her that the blackmail money was at his premises at No 6.

Just engaging in a little speculation, which I'm sure, by now, will not surprise you.

Best regards, George