Jack Was Careless?

[BLUE WIZZARD]

The first kill..(on a drive way) between too streets, with no way out if a cop or a pedestrian should happen by. or did he hide out on the other side of the gate so he could hear the response of the people discovering the body? then slip out when the crowd arrived...blending in with them.

He was reckless and did not really care if he got caught, so maybe he just walked to the end of the street without a care in the world, and kill the first witness that may have had the unfortunate luck of seeing him.

Was he driven by a very strong impulse to kill? to do it in the middle of the street? sounds like a guy who just did not care and commit crimes in the open, a stupid person with exceptional luck on his side.

Perhaps he believed that plans never work out the way you want, and he just took unnecessary chances. Pure stupidity with a dark angle watching over him.

BW

[Jon Guy]

Hello BW

An interesting comparison is Sutcliffe, in his own words he would drive wherever his victim would direct him and usually smack them on the back of the head as they were getting into the back seat of his car. On a number of occasions he recalled that after the onslaught he would notice that there were a couple sitting nearby, or a taxi parked a few yards from where he was, only then did he think of the consequence.

It does seem that a cursory check is made before the attack. Sutcliffe reported that the smell of cheap perfume, alcohol and sweat would cause the anger to suddenly well up in him.

[BLUE WIZZARD]

Hello Jon,

His Mother may have abused him when he was young, she may have been in a drunken stupor, the smell of cheap perfume and booze. Sounds like a trigger that sets him off when he smells the same combination. Unless his dad wore cheap perfume…”now that is really weird.”

I’m just guessing at this because I do not know of Sutcliffe.

These people that abuse children do not know what kind of problems they create for future generations...in some cases perpetuating the problem.
Such as another Sutcliffe or another JTR. "Hate breeds hate".

I am a firm beleiver that it starts with the child.

BW

[FrankO]

...to do it in the middle of the street? sounds like a guy who just did not care and commit crimes in the open, a stupid person with exceptional luck on his side.

Hi Blue,

Even though he apparently took huge risks, especially in Chapman's case, I don't believe he was careless and didn't care if he was caught or not. He killed during what seems to have been the nightly hours of lull, 'worked' quickly and efficiently, probably cutting the throat in such a way that he didn't get too much blood on him (as was the general medical opinion of the day), quite probably also to let his victims bleed out before he started the mutilations. And he was never seen, not even heard walking away from a crime scene. So, I don't believe it was sheer luck that kept him in the streets. But I don't believe him to have been much of a planner either.

All the best,
Frank

[Mitch Rowe]

All he needs is a gun. Ostrog had a gun. Why not JTR?
If I had a gun in those times I would feel I could do what I wanted. Ostrog certainly thought so.

[kensei]

All he needs is a gun. Ostrog had a gun. Why not JTR?
If I had a gun in those times I would feel I could do what I wanted. Ostrog certainly thought so.

Ostrog never actually shot anyone, did he?

As for JTR, it has crossed my mind how vastly different the case would be regarded today if Jack the Ripper had instead been Jack the Shooter. I don't think he would have been as famous. Not quite sure why I feel this way, I just get the impression that he would not have been an earlier prototype to the Son of Sam.

[BLUE WIZZARD]

Hi Frank,

A gun is loud attracts too much attention, but it did not mean he did not carry one...should he need it to drop a cop, or a witness. This was a vicious man.
The knife was his favorite weapon for many reasons only he could tell you.

The number of prostitutes walking the street at that hour not to mention the Pub flies and cops, a lot of people on the streets at all hours, and Jack decides to kill someone and dissects them right then and there???
Like urinating in the middle of the street, you might have a rush that someone just might come by and see you do it, it is a chance you take, a reckless chance; Jack must have had a rush killing in the middle of the street?

Killing going on all over the place at the time of JTR, and I will bet that Jack did it, not to get attention but just Jack being himself doing what comes natural to him. Then the newspaper gives him a name, now Jack thinks he is a celebrity. For all we know it may have been just a couple of kills, then Jack would have been on his way, of course now that he was a celebrity in his own mind, well then the show must go on.

BW

There is an old saying "Better to have a gun and not need one, than to need a gun and not have one"

[FrankO]

The knife was his favorite weapon for many reasons only he could tell you.

Hi Blue,

Yes, his knife was his favourite weapon because it served best acting out his fantasies.

The number of prostitutes walking the street at that hour not to mention the Pub flies and cops, a lot of people on the streets at all hours, and Jack decides to kill someone and dissects them right then and there???

I agree that people were living much more out in the streets than today, however where were the pub flies, cops and others in Nichols' case, where were they in Chapman's case, where were they in Eddowes' case and where were they in Kelly's case? And even though she may not have been a Ripper victim, where were they in Tabram's case?

Most people were probably trying to get some sleep during the time those women were killed, indoors as well as outdoors. So the best time for the Ripper to strike would be when most people were trying to sleep, and when the prostitutes were at their most desperate. Which is what he seems to have done in most cases, judging from the number of witnesses in each of those cases. There were only few to none.

Does that mean that the Ripper wasn't careless? No, to some degree he obviously was, I'm just saying that it wasn't sheer luck all the time that kept him on the streets (although in Chapman's case he was very lucky indeed).

All the best,
Frank

[BLUE WIZZARD]

Hey Frank,

Most people trying to get sleep at that hour in my opinion were people with jobs at slaughter houses, stores, business as usual type, but the unfortunates usually drank their doss money away and had to work the streets at the time jack was lurking around.

Now just a guess, how many unfortunates do you think were without doss money walking around at any given night that Jack was looking for a spare part? They would wonder around just about anywhere, oppose to the cop that had a planed route.

A witness comes around unexpected, which Jack could not predict, but a cop could be predicted to approach a certain area at a certain time. Now pub flies are unpredictable as well, with all that chance of being caught, if you were Jack would you do it in plain site? I would say not. Jack was too reckless a chance taker and because no one happened by, he was a very lucky guy. Kind of like Garry Ridgeway wouldn’t you say?

BW

[BLUE WIZZARD]

Unsolvable

Unsolvable:

This site is puzzling to me, 1888 to 2009, approximately 121 years ago a man called Jack the Ripper killed a few women in the White chapel area, and he has never been caught or identified. There have been many books written about him and for what?

The Green River killer had been killing for 20 years, 45+ women dead, and although he was caught and sentence to die in prison, his story stops there.

Jack’s killing spree does not come near to the killers that follow after him. What more could possibly be said about him or his victims?

A lot of he said she said. Where does all that take you?

Perhaps the hope of someone finding out whom he is. This is never going to happen.

This is a dead horse, it seems like whenever someone comes up with something new, it will be beating the dead horse again, everyone seems to be in a box and they cannot get out.

It is like the man who reads the paragraph over and over again, with hope that the next time he reads it, it will change.

Would someone tell me why they think this is worth all the time and money to solve an unsolvable 121-year-old crime?

BW

[Sam Flynn]

Would someone tell me why they think this is worth all the time and money to solve an unsolvable 121-year-old crime?

Some of us appreciate that it's unsolvable, Wiz, but get a buzz from learning more about the people and the time and places in which they lived. There is still much to do in that regard, and even the most mundane can often turn out to be fascinating after a little research.

Just my take on it

[PLUCKING VIOLETS]

I have always found our interest difficult to explain;

It is about opinion, myth, Victorian London and a bit about how? why? The more we read about JTR the more we need to know and the more we know the more we need to read.

Every book we read provides us with the answer until we read the next one and every visit to the sites brings new questions to answer.

So why is a 120 year old mystery still important.

God knows!!!

All the best

[Ms Ermengarde]

Perhaps it's just what you said, BW. The Green River killer got caught, was sentenced, justice was done. It's not that his crimes would be lesser than the Ripper's. The Ripper just was never caught, possibly not even seen. His victims went unavenged, if I may use such a strong word. Certainly many people love the mystery of the unsolved and some maybe wish that _they_ were the person who noticed something crucial and solved the case.

For my part, I think that by keeping the case alive and by studying it I honor the memory of those women who never got justice. If we forgot them, it would make their fates lesser than the victims of some more recent killer. A murder is a murder is a murder. Every life is equally important.

Oh, and a happy New Year to everybody!

[Khanada]

Some of us appreciate that it's unsolvable, Wiz, but get a buzz from learning more about the people and the time and places in which they lived. There is still much to do in that regard, and even the most mundane can often turn out to be fascinating after a little research.

Just my take on it

A take I share. I got interested in Jack the Ripper because of a smart remark my mother once made in a department store, to another shopper. (To truncate the story.) My first JtR book led to more -- why not, I love to read anyway.

But back around 1988-1990ish, a show I was watching about Jack had a lady who made the comment that it's not really possible to understand Jack and his crimes if they're stripped of their historical context. (Not a direct quote, but the gist of her remarks.) And that led to reading about the Victorians.

Basically, I enjoy reading history anyway, and always did. But I wonder at times whether I would have ever gotten into reading about the LVP in England if I hadn't had an interest in old Jack first. (I solemnly swear that nothing else on earth ever had the power to get me to voluntarily read Jack London... ) The only thing that would be better than the books about the Victorians would be a time machine, so that I could go back to London in the late 1880's and just walk around and experience that time and place. (As it is, the closest I'm likely to ever get is to walk London Bridge in Arizona. I'll take what I can get.)

[BLUE WIZZARD]

time machine

Khanada has an interesting thought.

“The only thing that would be better than the books about the Victorians would be a time machine, so that I could go back to London in the late 1880's and just walk around and experience that time and place.”- Khanada

That was an interesting thought....( a time machine ) What if you could go back in time to the year 1888, what would you do to catch Jack, and of course not get yourself killed by jack?

Remember just because jack did not use a gun, does not mean that he did not have one. So you could be shot.

your advantage is to know when he will kill his next victim.

You cannot tell the cops because you will be under suspicion.

How would you go about catching Jack?

BW

"Pour attraper un tueur, il faut penser comme un tueur"