Dr T in British Paper!

[mklhawley]

Mike:

http://www.jtrforums.com/showthread.php?p=122679&highlight=mike+hawley#post122679

I didn't think I was ridiculing you...and I wasn't.
The thread ( link above) is working fine.

Hi Howard,

I have no proablem with people disagreeing with my interpretation of the limited evidence, especially if I'm on a wild goose chase. I will work on my work's filter in order for me to discuss the issues there (I'm still afraid of the wife, so fat chance it'll be at home).

Mike

[Howard Brown]

Mike:

http://www.jtrforums.com/showthread.php?p=122679&highlight=mike+hawley#post122679

I didn't think I was ridiculing you...and I wasn't.
The thread ( link above) is working fine.

[Rob Clack]

Hi Rob,

It really wasn't a counter to your point, but something I had been coincidentally reading. I should have clarified it. I was replying to your post out of courtesy. As far as it being a British paper mentioning Tumblety, yes, but I don't see that as a huge issue to completely negate my point. The Dundee Courier's source was obviously a US paper and was merely repeating it. I see the Hull's source a British newspaper. Yes, the Hull is merely repeating, but the Daily Telegraph wasn't.

Sincerely,
Mike

Hi Mike.

Oh ok, I thought the point of the thread was that Tumblety wasn't mentioned in the British, when he was.

Anyway mystery solved.

regards

Rob

[mklhawley]

Hi Mike,

I don't know why you posted that as it is not relevant.



A British paper did mention Tumblety by name, which is why I posted that article.

Regards

Rob

Hi Rob,

It really wasn't a counter to your point, but something I had been coincidentally reading. I should have clarified it. I was replying to your post out of courtesy. As far as it being a British paper mentioning Tumblety, yes, but I don't see that as a huge issue to completely negate my point. The Dundee Courier's source was obviously a US paper and was merely repeating it. I see the Hull's source a British newspaper. Yes, the Hull is merely repeating, but the Daily Telegraph wasn't.

Sincerely,
Mike

[DVV]

The wife would hang me if I spent my time on the forums in the evening (as I am doing now but she's not home).
Mike

Moi, ma femme préfère que je sois là qu'au bar.
Elle est bizarre, ma femme.

[mklhawley]

A third example! Now, the problem with Howard Brown's assessments about Francis Tumblety is his tendency to minimalize everything. On another one of his threads he attempted to ridicule my discovery of an article which stated Tumbelty was 'in custody'. His argument falls flat (which will be a future thread).--M.Hawley

Mike :

Please point out where I ridiculed your discovery of said article about Tumblety being in custody....


Thank you.

Hello Howard,

I was just on the link yesterday and today it does not work. Oh well, Nemo had posted on jtrforums about a year ago that I posted an article from Connecticut stating that Tumblety was 'in custody'. You had made a comment that you rejected the idea and could find multiple articles stating he was merely arrested, and you posted a few. One stated 'under arrest', so Nemo pointed out that this could mean in custody, so you replied 'under arrest' in England has a different meaning than in the States. Within that discussion, I felt you were ridiculing my position by your wording.

I would have joined jtrforum to discuss it there, but my work for some reason filters it out. The wife would hang me if I spent my time on the forums in the evening (as I am doing now but she's not home).

Mike

[Rob Clack]

Hi Rob,

The Dundee Courier & Argus , the same newspaper that in 1861 stated it would give a ready advocacy to sound Liberalism both at home and abroad.” I'm sure the Tories loved it.

Sincerely,

Mike

Hi Mike,

I don't know why you posted that as it is not relevant.

One argument against Francis Tumblety being considered a serious JTR suspect by Scotland Yard officials is that absolutely no British papers mention him,

A British paper did mention Tumblety by name, which is why I posted that article.

Regards

Rob

[Howard Brown]

A third example! Now, the problem with Howard Brown's assessments about Francis Tumblety is his tendency to minimalize everything. On another one of his threads he attempted to ridicule my discovery of an article which stated Tumbelty was 'in custody'. His argument falls flat (which will be a future thread).--M.Hawley

Mike :

Please point out where I ridiculed your discovery of said article about Tumblety being in custody....


Thank you.

[lynn cates]

the point

Hello Mike. Ah, I see what you mean.

Cheers.
LC

[mklhawley]

Wolf,

Even though I'm a pain to you, you've forgotten more stuff than I will probably ever know. I would love to know more about the Jarvis and Shore info. I know Simon has research it.

Mike

[Wolf Vanderlinden]

The same article from the Eastern Morning News, 2 January, 1889, in post #1 also appeared in the Belfast News Letter, Thursday, 3 January,1889, and the Ipswich Journal, Friday, 4 January, 1889, as well as some others. This news wasn't, therefore, reported in only one British newspaper as was originally thought.

There was a theory put forth on the boards a while back, I don't remember whose exactly, that the "man suspect of knowing a good deal about this series of crimes [who] left England for this side of the Atlantic three weeks ago" was actually referring to Inspector Andrews or possibly Shore or Jarvis and not Tumblety.

In 1890 Tumblety's name once more appeared in a British newspaper in connection with the Whitechapel Murders:

A “JACK THE RIPPER” SUSPECTED.

WASHINGTON, WEDNESDAY.

Dr. Francis Tumblety, who was at one time suspected of being “Jack the Ripper,” has been committed to gaol as a suspicious character. Many valuables were found on him at the time of his arrest.
The Western Mail (Cardiff, Wales) 20 November, 1890.

And again after his death in 1903:

A “RIPPER” ECHO.

Dr. Francis Tumblety died recently in the Charity Hospital at St. Louis. A remarkable incident in his career was his arrest on the suspicion that he was “Jack the Ripper.” On another occasion he was accused of complicity in a plot to infest the North with yellow fever during the Civil War. Dr. Tumblety left a fortune of over 27,000l.
Lloyds Weekly News, 28 June, 1903.

Wolf.

[mklhawley]

Does Scotland count?

THE DUNDEE COURIER & ARGUS
Wednesday 26 December 1888


IS THIS THE WHITECHAPEL MURDERER!
AN EXTRAORDINARY PERSONAGE.
A man calling himself Dr Tumblety was arrested some time ago in London on suspicion of being concerned in the perpetration of the Whitechapel murders. ..., it brought some to him.”

Hi Rob,

The Dundee Courier & Argus , the same newspaper that in 1861 stated it would give a ready advocacy to sound Liberalism both at home and abroad.” I'm sure the Tories loved it.

Sincerely,

Mike

[mklhawley]

Hi Mike,

What British investigative reporters?

The Hull and Thanet newspapers were sent the stories from a press agency as column fillers.

Regards,

Simon

Hi Simon,

You are correct on the Hull, but notice it received the info from the Daily Telegraph. I just found a few nineteenth century comments about investigative reporting with them. I'll post it if you'd like.

Mike

[Simon Wood]

Hi Mike,

What British investigative reporters?

The Hull and Thanet newspapers were sent the stories from a press agency as column fillers.

Regards,

Simon

[mklhawley]

Hi Mike,

What do you mean, "Notice how this British paper decided not to name Tumblety, further supporting my point"?

If the two UK newspapers weren't told the suspect's name, they had no choice in the matter.

And what all this about Inspector Andrews not making it to NYC suddenly being irrelevant?

It's the very nub of your Tumblety as Ripper suspect argument.

Regards,

Simon

Hi Simon,

Notice the dates of these articles. The British investigative reporters would suck if they didn't know about Tumblety.

Andrews not making it to NYC has absolutely nothing to do with the Tumblety/Ripper suspect argument. Andrews' intentions were always to stay in Canada. He was not 'chasing' Tumblety. Just because they messed up that point does not ruin the credibility of the entire article. Besides, my point deals with Tumblety's name not being mentioned.

Mike