Metropolitan Police view of Tumblety today

[Wolf Vanderlinden]

Hello G F (if you're still out there)

What I suppose I should have written was that “Scotland Yard, through official channels, had the Toronto authorities contacted, to ask if they would be amenable to paying for Inspector Andrews to return Roland Gideon Israel Barnett to Canada…”

This letter of the 23rd of November doesn't seem to me to show that Scotland Yard had contacted the Toronto authorities on the 19th but rather that Anderson had written to the Home Office on the 19th concerned about the fact that Barnett was still languishing in custody and asking what was to happen. This reply then shows that the Home Secretary had just received (on the 23rd) 'an intimation' from the Colonial Office that the Canadian Government would 'at once be asked by telegraph' if they would cover the cost of the conveyance of Barnett to Canada. I guess that you have translated this differently.

Yes, my observation was based on PRO [HO 134/10]. Barnett was in custody in London under a Canadian warrant which asked that he be extradited back to Toronto to face fraud charges. As the request was Canadian and Barnett was English the extradition was covered under the Fugitive Offenders Act of 1881 (44 and 45 Vict, cap 69) under which the Canadian authorities had to prove that there was sufficient evidence to warrant the extradition. Toronto had sent their evidence to London on the 4th of October and awaited a response. As of the 19th of November, the same date that Anderson wrote to the Home Office, Toronto had received no reply from London and was still waiting the results of the extradition procedure. This would seem to indicate that the procedure had ended on or about the 19th . Whatever the case, the Canadian request was granted and Barnett was to be extradited back to Toronto.

Scotland Yard didn’t have to wonder “what was to happen” to Barnett since it wasn’t their responsibility to ship him to Toronto. It was Toronto’s responsibility to come and pick him up; something Toronto was waiting to do. Instead, however, Anderson calculated the costs of sending a Scotland Yard Inspector to Canada to deliver Barnett and then contacted the Secretary of State at the Home Office asking if the costs could be picked up by the Canadians. This was not the normal procedure and indicates a desire on the part of Anderson to have Andrews travel to Canada (actually southern Ontario) for some reason.

In view of the fact that Scotland Yard had no hard evidence against Tumblety I am sure that they would never have contemplated an expensive trip to North America to locate him. But given the chance of this 'free trip' they would see the opportunity of making inquiries whilst there.

Andrews was free to go wherever he wanted in North America as soon as he docked in Halifax because Inspector Stark of the Toronto Police was there to take Barnett off his hands. As Tumblety had recently been in New York it would seem an obvious place to start “making inquiries.” Instead Andrews got on the train with Stark and Barnett and travelled to Toronto where he was booked into the best hotel in the city. Andrews is reported to have had talks with various shadowy figures and to have travelled to various locations in Southern Ontario and then, after a week of this, to have left to go back home. He didn’t get within 500 miles of Tumblety.

Wolf.

[Simon Wood]

Hi Cap'n Jack and Natalie,

This thread gets better by the minute.

First subsequent thought—

By October 9th(?)—a month before all the Tumblety shenanigans— that sage Commissioner Warren penned in a memo his belief that the Ripper correspondence was the work of a Fleet Street hack (or words to that effect). It's a pity this thought hadn't occurred to him before going to the trouble and expense of having all those posters printed and creating a worldwide JtR scare on the feeble premise of some poor ignorant fool recognising the handwriting.

A Fleet Street hack would seem to rule out Tumblety (unless he was moonlighting)—also the Macnaghten triumvirate of Druitt, Kosminski and Ostrog (the latter basking in a Parisian prison cell at the time of the WM) as authors of the Ripper correspondence. Could Kosminski chalk schoolboy English? Where did these policemen get their information? From the back of a cereal packet?

So I doubt Anderson (low class Polish Jew suspect) was hoping to match Tumblety's handwriting to the Dear Boss letter. And would he or Crowley have gone to the expense of transatlantic cables (£100 for the first twenty words) to catch a bloke for homosexual offences?

Second subsequent thought—

We appear to have a link between Tumblety and John P. Hayes. Again the Fenian connection. By extension, we also have a further link to Littlechild, into whose purview such matters appeared.

Although under CID surveillance, Piggott escaped to Spain, where he obligingly committed suicide. And despite official protestations to the contrary, Tumblety appears to have been allowed to escape to France and subsequently the US. For what nefarious reasons we shall probably never know.

So here's my final two-bob's worth.

What better high-profile cover for Tumblety to travel to the US than that of a man under the cloud of jumping bail on suspicion of possible complicity in the WM? What more could take people's eye off the ball?

Tumblety died in St Louis in 1903, fifteen years after the WM. If he had any provable involvement, why was he never extradited?

Also remember that, thanks to Walsingham in the sixteenth century, by 1888 Britain had over 300 years' experience in defining and refining the art of deception and duplicity.

Regards,

Simon

PS. Cap'n Jack—how did you know I had a black belt in Mah Jong?

[Natalie Severn]

Thanks Timothy.That sum was the one quoted in Andrew Cook"s book [page81 MI 5"s First Spymaster].The author probably read the dollar sign as a pound sterling sign.However, the sum of £300 in 1888 by my calculations it would be about £143.000 in today"s money.Thats quite big in reddies.


Simon,
I am curious about the handwriting request too.Ofcourse it might just be to see if it tallied with any Ripper letters received.
Best
Natalie

[timothy]

Tumblety's Bail

Hi Natalie,

Tumblety’s bail was £300 or equivalent to $1500. I have only found two other cases for gross indecency where bail was mentioned. In one the bail was £200 and the other it was £500. Given these cases, Tumblety’s bail does not seem excessive or unusual.

Best,

Tim

[Natalie Severn]

And Natalie, some reports I have read appear to indicate that Tumblety was related to Hayes.

I believe this may be possible,despite it not being the case that Tumblety was the uncle of John P Hayes, the Philadelphian Irish "informer".
John P Hayes is cited in Andrew Cook"s "M" ,MI 5"s First Spymaster"as well as in Fenian Fire by Christy Campbell.He was not dead by 1888/89 .
Interestingly Hayes the "anti Fenian " informer, later befriended the serial killer Cream and set up an entrapment plot for him to fall into.He was therefore responsible, with another detective ,Patrick McIntyre,for eventually bringing him to justice.This is all to the good because not all reports of him are particularly savoury-In Paris,according to notes written by Michael Davitt [Parnell"s defence] ,Hayes was remarked upon for having "lived with whores and drinking"-all the while talking dynamite war .He used both Haynes and Hayes as surnames.In court providing evidence on Cream though he was "Hayes".
Interestingly, the Tumblety relatives in Philadelphia who were bestowed legacies in his will, also used both Haynes and Hayes as their surnames.
But John P Hayes was a very useful informer to quite a number of people,including,in the Autumn of 1888, the British Consul in New York, William Robert Hoare.I think this John P Hayes is worth looking into further.
Tumblety"s bail was £1,500-an enormous sum of money in those days.Its said he knew the men who stood bail for him only two or three days.Given there was a huge file on Tumblety and his history as a " con man" its quite astonishing he was able to either obtain or jump bail.But he did and there are no records to say anyone took the rap.Rather like the other case Abberline was involved in a year later when the Cleveland St scandal broke and the wealthy men who ran the club and faced imprisonment were also,like Tumblety,allowed to run off to France via various safe passages.However good a spymaster this "M" was he doesnt seem to have been much cop in his job keeping "Port Watch".
Anyway,not only did they "lose" Tumblety himself forever---they also lost all those files Littlechild told us about in his 1913 letter.....how inconvenient!
Natalie

[Cap'n Jack]

A good thought, Simon.
You must be very good at Mah Jong.

I suppose one answer to your question is that perhaps Scotland Yard wanted to compare Tumblety's handwriting with the few letters they had received supposedly from the Whitechapel Murderer which they imagined at the time to be genuine.
The next logical conclusion of that is that Tumblety's writing did not match any of these 'genuine' letters and he was dismissed as a suspect for writing one or more of the letters.
But then again it is always possible that Scotland Yard had obtained some of Tumblety's many love letters to his various boyfriends - I have given original examples of Tumblety's love letters elsewhere - and were seeking active confirmation from an independent source that these letters were indeed written by Tumblety.
As we know, Tumblety was fond of his pen, but it is his sword we are unsure about.

[Simon Wood]

Hi All,

This is a most interesting thread.

A thought occurred to me, and my apologies if it's been mentioned before.

Crowley was sending Anderson samples of Tumblety's handwriting.

What previous letters/documents etc written by Tumblety [either about cottaging or the WM] could Anderson possibly be wanting to compare the samples with?

Regards,

Simon

[Cap'n Jack]

No worries, Natalie, always my pleasure to help.

RJP, I'm still waiting to hear your comments about the case I found of Tumblety being up for manslaughter in Liverpool, you'll remember it as the one you missed.

Oh my gosh! The 'Daily Alta' report of the 23rd November 1888.
I should shiver my timbers, right?

I think not, RJP. Mere confirmation of my credit here, and you, son, must learn to bite that Yankee dollar 'afore you swallow it.
'ere is your 'orrible press report in all its naked glory:

'The Daily Alta California
San Francisco, California
23 November 1888

DOCTOR TUMBLETY
Chief Crowley's Account of
His Career in San Francisco.
Chief Crowley has exchanged considerable correspondence with the Scotland Yard officials in reference to "Dr. Tumblety" who is under arrest on suspicion of being implicated in the Whitechapel murders. Chief Crowley sent a telegram on the 19th inst. to the London detectives, informing them that he could furnish specimens of Tumblety's hand-writing, and yesterday received the following answer from the Chief of the Scotland Yard detectives: "Thanks; send writing and all details you can in relation to him. - Anderson."

Chief Crowley has discovered that Tumblety still has a balance in the Hibernia Bank, which he left there when he disappeared from the city, and which never since has been drawn upon. Tumblety came here from Toronto in March 1870, and rented an office at No. 20 Montgomery street, where he remained until the following September. He then disappeared as suddenly as he came, and in 1871 turned up in New York.'

Bloody hell RJP, I needn't even load my cannon, just throw a load of soap at you.

[Natalie Severn]

Well Cap"n Jack,that was a fair find if ever there was one!I thankee for that mi hearty!
Seriously, we may just be getting a bit closer to the mystery of Tumblety if he really was related in any way to John P Hayes,the Philadelphia informer.
In the Autumn of 1885,above a Soho pub , a plot was hatched to destroy Parnell by a coterie of disaffected men: it comprised among others,the husband of Parnell"s mistress,Captain William O"Shea,Richard Pigott the forger of The Times letters purporting to have been scribed by Parnell , a Captain Stephens,- reputed to have hung a miscreant Ashanti with his bare hands-AND JOHN HAYES the Phioladelphia informer!
So if this John P Hayes was really related to Tumblety then it could be of some significance---
Natalie

[rjpalmer]

Hi AP - The thing I’ve enjoyed the most about your posts over the years is that you can find a reference to a land dispute involving Sir Godfrey Codbush in Essex in the year 1696 and weave it into a highly evocative tale showing the deep corruption of the Cutbush paternal line, but when there’s large clouds of black smoke billowing out of Tumblety’s cabin, or bloody cuff-stains on Druitt or red smears on Kosminski’s bed linen it is all ‘rubbish’ and ‘mirrors.’ I do enjoy a bloke who knows his mission in life. Carry on. I’m still vanishing sideways, but I just came by to say that I received an email this morning informing me that Mr. Chetcuti forwarded the Daily Alta California report to Stephen Ryder some four years ago or so; I was unaware of that, but the good news is that you can check it out for yourself and rethink your corrupted chronology. Ciao. RP

[Cap'n Jack]

Full text of cable from Anderson to Chief Crowley:

'HIS HANDWRITING.

P. Crowley, Chief of Police, San Francisco, Cal.: Thanks. Send handwriting and all details you can of Tumblety.


Anderson,
Scotland Yard.'

[Cap'n Jack]

Like this one, Nats, and please remember that Tumblety left some of his loot to this lot:

'Vallejo Chronicle
California, U.S.A.
Tuesday, 20 November 1888

VALLEJO STILL AHEAD.
A Former Resident Held for the Whitechapel Murder.

Vallejo never takes a back seat while notoriety is going around, and after nearly every character that becomes distinguished before the world could be written in truth, "formerly of Vallejo." There have been heirs to European thrones working on Mare Island, the captain of a Vallejo Military company is claiming the great Tichnorne estate in England, a former Vallejoite is the latest brigand of Southern California, and another narrowly escaped lynching for the most heinous murder of the year. The greatest men of modern history and the most consummate rascals of the time have all dwelt more or less in our city. But the latest glory that Vallejo has achieved is an applicant for the position of principal in the greatest horror of modern times, the Whitechapel murders in England.

Francis Tumblety, who, according to a cable dispatch, was arrested in London on suspicion of being concerned in the Whitechapel murders lived in Vallejo about thirteen years ago and was an uncle of the late John Hayes. He made John a present of a black horse with a white face that John used to travel about with very much. Many old residents remember him well and say that he answers exactly to the description given by the London papers of him, "about fifty-five years old, tall and rather heavy, and looks as if he painted his cheeks and dyed his hair. He has a heavy mustache and side whiskers."

[Cap'n Jack]

And Natalie, some reports I have read appear to indicate that Tumblety was related to Hayes.

[Natalie Severn]

post script re identity of Jenkinson"s informer

It looks as though a certain John P Hayes was actually Jenkinson"s man in Philadelphia and probably gave warning of the London Bridge attack in 1884.
However, if any one man really got about in those days it was certainly Tumblety.He went to and fro across the Atlantic in 1883/4 more times than I"ve had hot dinners.He had gone to Paris in the 1870"s.He lived in and and presumably got to know San Francisco where the dynamite for the London Bridge attack came from.He also had one of his "Herbal remedy" shops almost opposite the Clan"s Philadelphia headquarters .Its believed by some he even had such a Herbal shop in the East End at one point,on the Whitechapel Road near the Polly Nichol"s murder .You get dizzy tracing his movements and trouble with the law---he did business deals in New Orleans,Washington,Canada ,Birmingham,Liverpool----.And to what purpose were they--especially those crossings from Europe to America and back again in the mid 1880"s?
Natalie

[Natalie Severn]

Yes, RJ, it certainly appears the case that the various news reporters and their editors were having difficulty reading between the lines of the Anderson/Chief Crowley telegraph correspondence-two heads of CID no less.It beggars belief that either of these men would have been be loose tongued to reporters over a man suspected of being either the Whitechapel murderer or ,even worse in their eyes, a Fenian sympathiser possibly involved in the smuggling a cache of dynamite used in the London Bridge bombing fiasco.
And yes RJ, it was found to have been produced by the Safety Nitro Company of San Francisco.The cache was found in the vacated Harrow Road lodging house of William Mackey Lomasney, a member of Clan na Gael,and the leader of the dynamite plot, who atomised himself, his brother and John Flemming in the explosion under London Bridge in 1884.
Interestingly Jenkinson-dubbed "spy master general" -had had "prior warning" from Philadelphia of this little ol" London Bridge plot which was why he had ordered the gratings to be installed the previous March [1884].
Now Jenkinson depended for his information on an "illegal network of spies" ------so I cant help wondering in the light of your information, who precisely that "spy " was in this specific case,-this person with inside information on Clan na Gael activities, reporting to him from "Philadelphia", in March 1884? It could be well worth us trying to find out his name---or his alias!
I have always been a bit bewildered as to why Jenkinson"s "network" of "extra legal" spies,drawn often from pubs and the like, caused such outrage on behalf of Monro and Anderson and led to him being sacked.Was it just a sense of outraged "punctiliousness" on Anderson and Monro"s part or was it partly that they knew that underneath, Jenkinson was quite a dark horse -a supporter of Home Rule no less ,which they both regarded as a complete anathema they needed to prevent at all costs?
Anyway-----who was Jenkinson"s clan "informer" in Philadelphia in March 1884?
Best
Natalie