the diary

[Graham]

Don't you think it's funny that Mr Barrett has never taken advantage of the opportunity to link the diary to battlecrease I think that is very telling in its self.Also to go to trouble of planting it in battlecrease then not making any attempt to say "look this has come from maybricks old house it must be genuine"again very telling I think.

Yes PM, but until and unless Keith Skinner says his piece, if indeed he ever will, we don't know for sure if the 'Diary' ever was actually IN Battlecrease, and even if and when he does, it may well be his word against that of others.

I still think Paul Feldman didn't fully follow up the claim by the electrician that he'd taken the 'Diary' from a skip during alterations to Battlecrease. Very unlike Feldman, once he'd got his teeth into something, so it kind of suggests that he either didn't completely accept the electrician's story, or more likely it suited him not to. Such as the 'Diary' was abstracted from Battlecrease early in its existence and found its way into the possession of the Graham family, for example.

But if you believe that James Maybrick wrote the 'Diary', then by extension it must have been written in Battlecrease, as during the last months of Maybrick's life he didn't leave the place very often. If as most people believe it wasn't written by Maybrick yet spent time inside Battlecrease, then this opens up a whole new can of worms. Come on Keith, let's be hearing from you!

Graham

[Cogidubnus]

Personally Jason I think Mike Barrett is a poor dupe...I get the impression that half the time he was so pissed he'd hardly any idea what was going on...I hasten to add that this is what I've (perhaps incorrectly) read between the lines from various accounts...lots of us go through a phase like this between starting work and starting a family...most of us grow out of it pretty quickly...some alas do not...

If his missus had wanted to pull the wool or manipulate him, then in his state probably she could've, as easily as blink...she seems to have been the sober backstop of the marital partnership... I never met the guy at all, never mind during the critical years, but is this not your impression? She says she wanted to lift him out of himself and give him some sort of objective in life...well it just about could be...

If there's anybody in modern life holding things back about the origins of the Diary, (and I emphasise it's if), I'd say it'd be Anne...I'd like to see a little more concentration on the possible motives of Anne and a lot less emphasis on Mike who, rightly or wrongly, I tend to see as something of a cypher

All the best

Dave

[Graham]

Good points all, Dave. The Diary Debate compared with a few years ago on the pre-crash Forum is weak-kneed, but plainly it still interests a few people, and so it should. Paul Feldman was convinced that the 'Diary' was written by James Maybrick, who therefore was Jack the Ripper. Feldman went to extraordinary lengths (and huge expense) in his attempts to prove his belief, but I for one don't think he was successful. He seemed convinced by Anne's story that the 'Diary' had been known to her since her youth, and that it had been in the Graham family since at least 1940. Unfortunately, his 'interview' with Billy Graham proved nothing. I agree with you that Anne didn't reveal everything she knew about the 'Diary', but unless she is prepared to come on these boards and speak for herself there is little else we can say. I (for one) do not accept that according to the various 'experts' who carried out tests on it that the 'Diary' is a modern production, and if this is indeed the case there are many, many more questions to be asked.

Graham

[Cogidubnus]

I suspect then Graham, that like me, you suspect the Diary is an old forgery...which being the case, it'd be somewhat more than interesting to discover the motive behind it's creation!

All the best

Dave

[pinkmoon]

Personally Jason I think Mike Barrett is a poor dupe...I get the impression that half the time he was so pissed he'd hardly any idea what was going on...I hasten to add that this is what I've (perhaps incorrectly) read between the lines from various accounts...lots of us go through a phase like this between starting work and starting a family...most of us grow out of it pretty quickly...some alas do not...

If his missus had wanted to pull the wool or manipulate him, then in his state probably she could've, as easily as blink...she seems to have been the sober backstop of the marital partnership... I never met the guy at all, never mind during the critical years, but is this not your impression? She says she wanted to lift him out of himself and give him some sort of objective in life...well it just about could be...

If there's anybody in modern life holding things back about the origins of the Diary, (and I emphasise it's if), I'd say it'd be Anne...I'd like to see a little more concentration on the possible motives of Anne and a lot less emphasis on Mike who, rightly or wrongly, I tend to see as something of a cypher

All the best

Dave

Evening Dave,I think the answer to the whole diary story is quite straight forward I think Mr barretts wife only agreed to the story about diary been in her family to get rid of any police action aimed at Mr Barrett.I do not think Mrs Barrett had anything to do with this diary and I think Mr Barrett never in a million years expected people to take it so seriously like I've said before he couldn't believe that people took it so seriously.Mr Barrett told me lots of things three things were constant "I only wanted to raise enough money to buy a greenhouse" also"I did not believe they would take it so seriously"

[Graham]

Exactement, mon brave!

Graham

[pinkmoon]

Yes PM, but until and unless Keith Skinner says his piece, if indeed he ever will, we don't know for sure if the 'Diary' ever was actually IN Battlecrease, and even if and when he does, it may well be his word against that of others.

I still think Paul Feldman didn't fully follow up the claim by the electrician that he'd taken the 'Diary' from a skip during alterations to Battlecrease. Very unlike Feldman, once he'd got his teeth into something, so it kind of suggests that he either didn't completely accept the electrician's story, or more likely it suited him not to. Such as the 'Diary' was abstracted from Battlecrease early in its existence and found its way into the possession of the Graham family, for example.

But if you believe that James Maybrick wrote the 'Diary', then by extension it must have been written in Battlecrease, as during the last months of Maybrick's life he didn't leave the place very often. If as most people believe it wasn't written by Maybrick yet spent time inside Battlecrease, then this opens up a whole new can of worms. Come on Keith, let's be hearing from you!

Graham

Hi Graham,Mr Feldman did not follow up the workmen from battlecrease as thoroughly as he did other leads I think the reason being he was convinced Mrs Barrett was a descendant of Florence maybrick.I think when you step back and apply a bit of logic it's not to hard to work out how this diary appeared.

[Cogidubnus]

There are actually (at least) two ways that could be argued Jason..and provimg even a high likelihood of either could be something of a challenge...

All the best

Dave

[pinkmoon]

There are actually (at least) two ways that could be argued Jason..and provimg even a high likelihood of either could be something of a challenge...

All the best

Dave

The problem we have Dave is because of all the lies in the first place anything we are told by anyone involved with this diary we will think here we go again yet more lies.I am pretty certain I've worked out how Mr Barrett came to own the diary and own is the key word.I personally believe his wife has no connection to it at all.

[Scott Nelson]

Pinkmoon, you actually know Mike Barrett?

[Graham]

The problem we have Dave is because of all the lies in the first place anything we are told by anyone involved with this diary we will think here we go again yet more lies.I am pretty certain I've worked out how Mr Barrett came to own the diary and own is the key word.I personally believe his wife has no connection to it at all.

I'm very much inclined to agree with you, PM. If Anne had no connection at all with it, then either:

- Mike Barrett wrote it per his various claims, which I do not for one moment accept. If indeed he did write it, then he should go down in history as a forgery genius.

- he bought it from someone, either directly or indirectly, from some person unknown who found it in or near Battlecrease House.

- it was given to him by Billy Graham, without Anne's knowledge.

- he had contact with a descendant of someone who perhaps was on the staff of Battlecrease House, and who had obtained the 'Diary' by means unknown, and sold it to him.

- he found it secreted behind the wallpaper or in the loft in his house in Goldie Street.

- he found it when walking the dog, if he had a dog.

- it came from the Planet Zog.

Come on, Pinkmoon - own up!

Graham

[pinkmoon]

Pinkmoon, you actually know Mike Barrett?

Yes I've met him quite a few times over the years quite a character .

[pinkmoon]

I'm very much inclined to agree with you, PM. If Anne had no connection at all with it, then either:

- Mike Barrett wrote it per his various claims, which I do not for one moment accept. If indeed he did write it, then he should go down in history as a forgery genius.

- he bought it from someone, either directly or indirectly, from some person unknown who found it in or near Battlecrease House.

- it was given to him by Billy Graham, without Anne's knowledge.

- he had contact with a descendant of someone who perhaps was on the staff of Battlecrease House, and who had obtained the 'Diary' by means unknown, and sold it to him.

- he found it secreted behind the wallpaper or in the loft in his house in Goldie Street.

- he found it when walking the dog, if he had a dog.

- it came from the Planet Zog.

Come on, Pinkmoon - own up!

Graham

Graham the purpose of this diary for Mr Barrett was to raise some money he was spending all his money on alcohol very sad.Now for him to forge this he would have to shell out for a diary I think he claimed in his affidavit he paid 80 quid for it. A person with a drink problem is not going to go without his booze to buy a diary which may not make him any money so I think we can disregard the forgery side.A person who has forged a diary and wants to get it on the market in a believably way would not even consider getting Mr Barrett involved so that's that one out of the way.So that leaves one alternative I think and its not to far fetched either.

[Graham]

PM,

you're preaching to the converted about Mike Barrett possibly forging the 'Diary' himself - I never believed he did. Nor, I believe, did Anne. Therefore if the 'Diary' was not forged within the last 20 years or so, the chances are that it was written a long time ago, and by some means we don't yet know for sure eventually fell into the hands of the Barretts. I would very much like to hear your view on how this occurred. As you knew Mike Barrett, then perhaps you've got information no-one else has been privy to - I don't know. Obviously, if you feel you don't want at this time to divulge anything, then that's your prerogative and I for one would fully understand.

Graham

[pinkmoon]

PM,

you're preaching to the converted about Mike Barrett possibly forging the 'Diary' himself - I never believed he did. Nor, I believe, did Anne. Therefore if the 'Diary' was not forged within the last 20 years or so, the chances are that it was written a long time ago, and by some means we don't yet know for sure eventually fell into the hands of the Barretts. I would very much like to hear your view on how this occurred. As you knew Mike Barrett, then perhaps you've got information no-one else has been privy to - I don't know. Obviously, if you feel you don't want at this time to divulge anything, then that's your prerogative and I for one would fully understand.

Graham

morning Graham,Mike Barrett did not write diary of that I'm sure because of the watch I believe diary was written in battlecrease shortly after maybricks death.The stuff about his mate giving it him and his wife having it in is family is rubbish I think.I do have a theory and its quite straight forward it's not a conspiracy involving lots of people.Problem with all this is that so many lies have been told if we are every told the truth again will we believe it.I do believe Mrs Barrett only lied to keep Mr Barrett out of prison when or if the information keith skinner discoverd in 2007 is released to us I think it will tie in with what I believe