One Incontrovertible, Unequivocal, Undeniable Fact Which Refutes the Diary

[Soothsayer]

Ah, that's better - fresh air and the rolling Pentlands, not dank sweat and the peeling magnolia of a Bar L hotel room.

Who would have thought that it was still a criminal offence to impersonate a Chelsea Pensioner? Fortunately (you may disagree), it is no longer a capital offence, even though it was indeed a capital offence - caught in the act with a bagful of semtex and the plans to the Tower. Seems the Queen wants those crown jewels more than I realised (she should keep them in a jewellery box on her dressing table like Mrs Soothsayer if they mean that much to her).

I see that there have been lies, damned lies, and Unn Truths since my incarceration at Her Majesty's finest Caledonian guesthouse. If you have been struck by the recent general lack of comment on this site from the usual suspects, I have to tell you all now that my time in t'other place was not a lonely one: Sammy 'Mayhem' Flynn was in there, claiming he was simply trying to illustrate his point (it went on too long to be merely hypothetical, and the jury rapidly saw through his strange modernist defence). Graham was in solitary, which even he would admit is better than being sent to Coventry - charged with felony without a surname. On a related note, John Hacker was doing five to ten for taking his surname literally. Ben was doing a ten stretch for just being Ben. John 'Blancmange' Omlor was acting up with the Hispanics, tooled up with a gun made of soap. Very surreal.

Even more surreal was the steady flow of visitors of the fairer gender. Mrs Fiddymont practically had a tent outside. Archaic came over as often as the ferry. Babybird67 - despite her stunning beauty - disappointed the entire building when she arrived alone. Jessica Pisces slipped in under a pseudonym, and Janey Welland got a job as resident poet. It was like yet another party at John Omlor's house - every night raving 'til dawn with the smoke far sweeter than roll-ups.

But now the party is over. I've got a date with my parole officer - I think you all know who it is - and the ankle tag actually works now that the Prison Service finally twigged on to the need to put batteries in them. So who knows when I'll be able to find time to help you all solve the Original Crime?

PS Remind me to tell you the story about my bus journey home and the yellow ribbons ...

[Sam Flynn]

Sammy 'Mayhem' Flynn was in there

Correction: Sammy "Spreads-Mayhem-plus-Top-Myself-plus-One-Off-appearing-together-in-the-same-text" Flynn.

[Soothsayer]

Correction:
Sammy "Spreads-Mayhem-plus-Top-Myself-plus-One-Off-appearing-together-in-the-same-text" Flynn.

Samster,

Fair point - though the Minimalists in 'K' would soon have you on their htlst, I fear. You might be advised to borrow the Omlorian's soap gun (learn from JO, don't take it out in the rain).

PS Archaic smuggled her laptop in, I see ...

PPS It's just occurred to me that whoever first thought of the term 'minimalist' was being somewhat ironic.

[Soothsayer]

The Strangest Thing

Here's a most strange thing. Having just been trawling (not trolling before the barbs arrive), and again succumbed to the utter mince of Lies, Damn Lies, and Unn Truths, a thought has just occurred to me (not bad for late November, I hear you yell).

The journal was described as a shoddy hoax - apparently you could knock it up over a wet weekend in Milton Keynes, etc.. And yet, in reality it contains enough detail to have required a fair amount of research. So much so, perhaps, that our erstwhile forger came across the concept of the Victorian 'mole bonnet'.

The 'mole bonnet'. I ask you! Who amongst us has heard of a mole bonnet? Once again, our forger surprises us with the subtlety of his or her knowledge of the time. Hardly what one might intuitively expect of a casual fraudster?

Was our hoaxer a student of the quaintly-acronymed LVP?

It just makes me think there's more to this journal thing than meets the eye.

I'm starting to think it may well be the real McCoy, you know ...

[Kaz]

Hi all

Fascinating topic. Read The 'Diary' and 'The final Chapter' few years back, just ordered Shirley harrisons 'American connection' from amazon

IMO If the Diary is Fake its the luckiest one ever!

[John Hacker]

IMO If the Diary is Fake its the luckiest one ever!

In what way do you feel it was lucky?

[Kaz]

In what way do you feel it was lucky?

To have found someone who ties in so well on many different levels.

[jerrip]

I find this topic incredible, to have gone for over two years and 73 pages (I cheated and skip to last page) and everyone is still debating if the diary is fake or not, apparently no one involved read this:

http://www.casebook.org/suspects/james_maybrick/mb-con.bjan5.html

There's your "One Incontrovertible, Unequivocal, Undeniable Fact Which Refutes the Diary"

Barrett admitted it was fake, done, over, next topic, next suspect, Maybrick should be off the list.

The diary is fake.

Jer

[Stewart P Evans]

Not Quite So Easy

I find this topic incredible, to have gone for over two years and 73 pages (I cheated and skip to last page) and everyone is still debating if the diary is fake or not, apparently no one involved read this:

http://www.casebook.org/suspects/james_maybrick/mb-con.bjan5.html

There's your "One Incontrovertible, Unequivocal, Undeniable Fact Which Refutes the Diary"
Barrett admitted it was fake, done, over, next topic, next suspect, Maybrick should be off the list.
The diary is fake.
Jer

And so it undoubtedly is. But the 'diary' supporters will probably soon explain to you that it is not quite so easy to dismiss. In all honesty, if you don't like it, it's best ignored and better to turn one's attention to a more profitable area of study.

[caz]

Hi Stewart,

Indeed. This 'jerrip' is the only one keeping the Maybrick threads alive and kicking right now, by making three almost identical posts to three different 'dairy' threads, for some peculiar reason. At least he spells 'diary' correctly on this one.

Few people today would claim - with a straight face - that Mike Barrett's 'confessions' stand up to close scrutiny. But then even fewer have been 'debating' if the thing is a fake or not.

It's the handwriting that condemns it, not Mike the cheeky Scouser's tall tales.

Love,

Caz
X

[Kaz]

I find this topic incredible, to have gone for over two years and 73 pages (I cheated and skip to last page) and everyone is still debating if the diary is fake or not, apparently no one involved read this:

http://www.casebook.org/suspects/james_maybrick/mb-con.bjan5.html

There's your "One Incontrovertible, Unequivocal, Undeniable Fact Which Refutes the Diary"

Barrett admitted it was fake, done, over, next topic, next suspect, Maybrick should be off the list.

The diary is fake.

Jer

[Kaz]

Hi Stewart,

Indeed. This 'jerrip' is the only one keeping the Maybrick threads alive and kicking right now, by making three almost identical posts to three different 'dairy' threads, for some peculiar reason. At least he spells 'diary' correctly on this one.

Few people today would claim - with a straight face - that Mike Barrett's 'confessions' stand up to close scrutiny. But then even fewer have been 'debating' if the thing is a fake or not.

It's the handwriting that condemns it, not Mike the cheeky Scouser's tall tales.

Love,

Caz
X

I seem to remember asking you for clarification on maybricks handwriting awhile ago. how much more of it has emerged?

I fail to see how it 'prooves' anything. JTR was a (clearly) a madman, why should his reddy handwriting have to remain constant.

Not enough to put it to bed IMO

[robhouse]

I really don't know much about the diary, nor am I particularly interested in it. However, I did recently see one of the books at a local used bookstore, and it contained facsimiles of the pages, and the full transcription. I thumbed through it for a few minutes. The thing that immediately jumped out at me is that I was amazed that anyone ever took it seriously at all. Everything about it (to me anyway) just seemed so obviously fake... the language, the content of the diary... it read like something written by a high school student, with lines like "I can't wait to get started.." (going from memory.) Also that the handwriting just did not look authentic to the period either. I was just amazed that anyone ever believed it was authentic. It was way too obvious. (Of course I say this with the benefit of hindsight admittedly, but still...)

RH

[Casebook Wiki Editor]

However, I did recently see one of the books at a local used bookstore, and it contained facsimiles of the pages, and the full transcription. I thumbed through it for a few minutes.

Also that the handwriting just did not look authentic to the period either. I was just amazed that anyone ever believed it was authentic. It was way too obvious. (Of course I say this with the benefit of hindsight admittedly, but still...)

RH

Two quick comments:

The facsimiles don't remotely do the document justice. Not even close.

Have you ever read Jarndyce's opinion on the Diary ? They specialize in 19th century books and documents. Better yet, pop in there someday (they are across from the British Museum) and ask their opinion. I can tell you what they will say but best you get it from the horse's mouth. (Just to be clear - they know nothing about the Ripper case and hold Ripperologists in deep contempt. But they are one of the foremost antiquarian bookstores in London.)

[spyglass]

Sir Robert,

Why are Ripperoligists held in high contempt in that book shop?

Also I would just like to add, what ever we think about the diary, one cant help admire ( if it is a fake ) the hoaxers behind it.
It is it's self a fasinating mystery and if JTR is ever solved, at least we got something else to debate.