One Incontrovertible, Unequivocal, Undeniable Fact Which Refutes the Diary

[Sam Flynn]

Maybrick was your man - you can put money on it.

Thanks for the tip, Sooth. I shall hie me down to Ladbrokes tomorrow with 1 pee clutched firmly in ma haund.

[Soothsayer]

Thanks for the tip, Sooth. I shall hie me down to Ladbrokes tomorrow with 1 pee clutched firmly in ma haund.

I don't like to brag, Sam, but frankly it's where I got the name from. It's like a gift.

[Soothsayer]

Ah! I assumed, because he hasn't a clue, that he is slaying the sooth. My bad.

Mike

I thought your Truthslayer of some months ago was much funnier, The Good. Nevertheless, commendable effort.

[Magpie]

It's like a gift.

You didn't happen to keep the receipt, did you?

[The Grave Maurice]

Don't you listen to them, Sooth. If you want to believe Maybrick is our boy, then go right ahead. When the diary came out, I would have agreed with you...the FM on the wall appeared to me to be a clincher. Anyway, continued talk about the diary is a good thing if it leads to more sales and puts a few quid into Shirley Harrison's pocket; from what I have read of her, she seems to be a very pleasant individual.

I suspect that the FM only became visible in the flash when the photograph was taken. It may not have been discernible to the naked eye in a small room with two north-facing windows in November. I like your thought that the whole exercise was inspired by the forger's noticing the FM. After all, before the diary was published, only one person had ever mentioned initials on the wall----I think it was Simon Wood, but I'd have to look it up.

[Ben]

If they were not commented upon at the time of the murders it may very well have been because in 1888 it simply would never have occurred to anyone that a murderer would be twisted enough, or indeed vain enough, to leave a clue.

How would that work?

"Look! There's an F and an M on the wall, next to eachother, and writen in blood! From the killer, perhaps?"

"Oh, heavens no. No killer would do that. It must have been there already (??!!??)"

There are no letters there, Sooth. You're seeing what you believe to be letters, but letters they are not. I'm afraid someone must have given you the wrong idea.

[Soothsayer]

I suspect that the FM only became visible in the flash when the photograph was taken. It may not have been discernible to the naked eye in a small room with two north-facing windows in November.

Hope springs ever eternal! You make an extraordinarily insightful comment, The Grave. It had never occurred to me about the flash! THAT is what this site should be about. 10 out of 10 for quality thinking. My only regret is that I didn't say it (but then, as Wilde said, I'm sure I will).

I like your thought that the whole exercise was inspired by the forger's noticing the FM. After all, before the diary was published, only one person had ever mentioned initials on the wall----I think it was Simon Wood, but I'd have to look it up.

It was indeed Mr Wood, and I suspect he has regretted it ever since. Bit like me and the flash thing.

Anyway, brilliant brilliant observation - first class (it's reet cheered me up that one).

[Soothsayer]

You didn't happen to keep the receipt, did you?

Magpie,

Please don't encourage Mrs Soothsayer. She's just chuckling away in the kitchen at what you evidently believe to pass for wit. (I confess, I wish I'd thought of that one too.)

For the record, Mrs S wishes it to be known that she's been looking for the receipt for some years now ...

[Soothsayer]

How would that work?
"Look! There's an F and an M on the wall, next to eachother, and writen in blood! From the killer, perhaps?"

I think you answer your own question, Benjy Boy:

""Look! There's an F and an M on the wall, next to each other, and writen in blood! Wonder what's for tea?"

The point is, even if anyone had seen the letters (which are there, and everyone on this site knows they are), the lack of any previous 'Serial Killer Leaves Clues' headlines on the front pages of the Whitechapel Whinge, and other notable newssheets of the day, would more likely cause any onserver of them to drift off into a what's-for-tea muse than a wonder-if-the-world's-first-media-serial-killer-left-them-as-a-clue type muse.

Not commenting on something (on the record), is not the same as not seeing that thing.

Just my opinion, of course.

But, then, I am very clever ...

[Ben]

So...

Just to clarify then, you're seriously suggesting that the police noticed two letters written in blood, and decided they must have been written by someone other than the killer?

[Soothsayer]

Just to clarify then, you're seriously suggesting that the police noticed two letters written in blood, and decided they must have been written by someone other than the killer?

No, I'm seriously suggesting that we don't know that anyone saw anything and even if they did, that their first thought may not necessarily have been to assume the criminal caused them to be there.

I may as well plagiarise The Grave now rather than later: was there sufficient light to actually see such detail in the first place?

We are a trusting species in the main part - we see what we expect to see (I know, before you say it, I know). The Russians didn't catch what's his name, their serial killer of 50+ folk earlier primarily because they couldn't believe a Communist could act in such a way. They weren't expecting to find a Communist guilty, so they ignored the evidence. If the British police had never heard of serial killers, and therefore serial killers leaving clues, they may well have seen the 'FM' on Kelly's wall, along with all the other symbols and numbers, etc. which we have noticed (see other threads), and assumed there was no consequence to them.

Stranger things have happened ...

[Soothsayer]

You didn't happen to keep the receipt, did you?

PS Are you 'Magpie' due to some association or interest in the might that is Newcastle United Football Club?

[Ben]

No, I'm seriously suggesting that we don't know that anyone saw anything and even if they did, that their first thought may not necessarily have been to assume the criminal caused them to be there

Well, the notion that they missed something that you claim is so physically evident in an greatly aged photograph is clearly very difficult to swallow, but the idea they they did see them and attributed them to someone other than the killer is even more outlandish, if that's possible.

I'm not trying to be unpleasant here, but neither scenario is necessary if you accept that what you're looking at is not a couple of letters.

All the best,
Ben

[Bailey]

You gotta love the irony that the diary's handwriting doesn't match any of the Ripper letters or Maybrick's handwriting, yet apparently it does match the writing on MJK's wall which may or may not exist... Have we had a graphologist on this?

B. (Being a smartypants, but perfectly willing to front up to having been very pro-diary in the past. Now I don't buy it more than any other theory, but I'd love to know WHO wrote it)

[Soothsayer]

B. (Being a smartypants, but perfectly willing to front up to having been very pro-diary in the past. Now I don't buy it more than any other theory, but I'd love to know WHO wrote it)

B.

Let me save you any further doubt - it was James Maybrick ...

S.

PS Please, no cheap jokes about the unfortunate initials!