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One Incontrovertible, Unequivocal, Undeniable Fact Which Refutes the Diary

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  • "It's Saturday night and we are just minutes away from X Factor. Let's chill a wee bit for now, eh?

    Saturday night for you maybe but for me here (Washington, D.C.) it is Saturday afternoon and there is a lot of apartment cleaning that needs to be done that has my name on it.

    Yeah, but we all could stand to chill for a bit.

    c.d.

    Comment


    • Surely if Wor Jackie was going to put some 'clues' in the form of letters on walls he would have put them higher up and in the middle of the wall where they could be more easily noted. Surely he would have been covered in blood and bits if he had leaned across the bed to write FM on the wall after the deed. I believe no 'witness' report has ever mentioned said writing on the wall and if it was important to Jack to get his message across it would have been more in plain sight.
      Also the 'F' on her arm (which I still say is two cuts and a shadow) would have been the other way around not upside down and again more visible. Did any of the 'witnesses' again spot this? I'm sure a large carved 'F' would have been in the doctors list of 'injuries' and for me would have been spotted by the police present and noted as important.

      Comment


      • I think the diary is 100 percent genuine except for one thing. The words.

        Comment


        • Originally posted by John Wheat View Post
          I think the diary is 100 percent genuine except for one thing. The words.

          Comment


          • Originally posted by John Wheat View Post
            I think the diary is 100 percent genuine except for one thing. The words.
            Well spoken that man !!!

            Comment


            • Originally posted by Geddy2112 View Post
              Surely if Wor Jackie was going to put some 'clues' in the form of letters on walls he would have put them higher up and in the middle of the wall where they could be more easily noted. Surely he would have been covered in blood and bits if he had leaned across the bed to write FM on the wall after the deed. I believe no 'witness' report has ever mentioned said writing on the wall and if it was important to Jack to get his message across it would have been more in plain sight.
              Also the 'F' on her arm (which I still say is two cuts and a shadow) would have been the other way around not upside down and again more visible. Did any of the 'witnesses' again spot this? I'm sure a large carved 'F' would have been in the doctors list of 'injuries' and for me would have been spotted by the police present and noted as important.
              Hi Geddy

              It's all been discussed before. I'm just waiting to see what old Ike's thoughts are on the matter. I'd say the writing on the wall in Goulston Street primed the police to carefully scrutinise any further murder scene for messages left by the killer. There's no way they would have missed the letters F M daubed on the wall using her blood. Not a chance.

              Comment


              • Originally posted by Observer View Post
                It's all been discussed before. I'm just waiting to see what old Ike's thoughts are on the matter. I'd say the writing on the wall in Goulston Street primed the police to carefully scrutinise any further murder scene for messages left by the killer. There's no way they would have missed the letters F M daubed on the wall using her blood. Not a chance.
                Indeed and how correct you are.... of course there could have been an FM left there and it could have meant something else... like erm... FREE MASONS!!!

                /runs away...

                Comment


                • Originally posted by John Wheat View Post
                  I think the diary is 100 percent genuine except for one thing. The words.
                  Nope not even the book is 100% genuine.
                  G U T

                  There are two ways to be fooled, one is to believe what isn't true, the other is to refuse to believe that which is true.

                  Comment


                  • Hi,
                    Just one question, what makes everyone think that the clue that was left for everyone to see was the so called letters on the wall by the bed ?
                    Just saying.

                    Regards.

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by spyglass View Post
                      Hi,
                      Just one question, what makes everyone think that the clue that was left for everyone to see was the so called letters on the wall by the bed ?
                      Just saying.

                      Regards.
                      I don't.
                      G U T

                      There are two ways to be fooled, one is to believe what isn't true, the other is to refuse to believe that which is true.

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by Geddy2112 View Post
                        Surely if Wor Jackie was going to put some 'clues' in the form of letters on walls he would have put them higher up and in the middle of the wall where they could be more easily noted. Surely he would have been covered in blood and bits if he had leaned across the bed to write FM on the wall after the deed. I believe no 'witness' report has ever mentioned said writing on the wall and if it was important to Jack to get his message across it would have been more in plain sight.
                        Also the 'F' on her arm (which I still say is two cuts and a shadow) would have been the other way around not upside down and again more visible. Did any of the 'witnesses' again spot this? I'm sure a large carved 'F' would have been in the doctors list of 'injuries' and for me would have been spotted by the police present and noted as important.
                        'Surely' is usually how posts start when you're about to tell us what you would have done.

                        How do you mean that the 'F' is upside down? Surely you don't imagine Jack knew the scene would be photographed and exactly how it would be photographed???????

                        Iconoclast

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                        • Originally posted by John Wheat View Post
                          I think the diary is 100 percent genuine except for one thing. The words.
                          Let us know what you think once you've read any of the four books on the subject.

                          Iconoclast

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by Observer View Post
                            Hi Geddy

                            It's all been discussed before. I'm just waiting to see what old Ike's thoughts are on the matter. I'd say the writing on the wall in Goulston Street primed the police to carefully scrutinise any further murder scene for messages left by the killer. There's no way they would have missed the letters F M daubed on the wall using her blood. Not a chance.
                            And your evidence for that lies where? Where can I source the back Police reports which focus on the need to be vigilant at future crime scenes for possible writing or clues?

                            Old Ike says you can't because no such directives were given. It was 1888, man. They didn't think like today's police would think. If they did, we'd know it from the copious evidence.

                            And you would have known that if you'd read any of it ...

                            'Not a chance'. Fair enough, you are welcome to your opinion. PLease don't confuse it without anything more tangible or meaningful - such pronouncements confuse the weakminded as fact.
                            Iconoclast

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by Iconoclast View Post
                              How do you mean that the 'F' is upside down? Surely you don't imagine Jack knew the scene would be photographed and exactly how it would be photographed???????
                              He knew how people would enter the room I would imagine as in through the door. If the arm was straight the F would be the correct way up. However he flexed her arm so to anyone entering the room it's upside down. Although as I earlier pointed out it's not (IMHO) an F just two cuts on her arm with a shadow crease representing what you consider the F's vertical stroke.

                              Again if Jack wanted to leave a message it would have been a lot more prevalent than this and I'm sure the F on her arm would have been listed by the Doctor at the post mortem. I'm fairly certain it was not. As also pointed out any 'text' at the scene would have been documented to see if it matched the GSG... surely!

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by Geddy2112 View Post
                                He knew how people would enter the room I would imagine as in through the door. If the arm was straight the F would be the correct way up. However he flexed her arm so to anyone entering the room it's upside down. Although as I earlier pointed out it's not (IMHO) an F just two cuts on her arm with a shadow crease representing what you consider the F's vertical stroke.

                                Again if Jack wanted to leave a message it would have been a lot more prevalent than this and I'm sure the F on her arm would have been listed by the Doctor at the post mortem. I'm fairly certain it was not. As also pointed out any 'text' at the scene would have been documented to see if it matched the GSG... surely!
                                Not 'surely' at all. 'Possibly', of course, but also 'possibly not'.

                                Try not to see 1888 as an old version of 1988. The police's definition of forensic analysis in 1888 was sweeping everything into a bucket and chucking it out. If they were sensitive to the possibility of clues from the GSG, it would have been documented in the evidence. Have a read of 'The Ultimate Jack the Ripper Sourcebook'. I think you'll find that there was none. The police were not primed to look for writing, and there is no logic that says they were actively looking for clues other than the bodies themselves.

                                In colour, the actual scene of Kelly's death would have been pure red carnage. It was 1888 and forensics was almst nonexistent. Imagine yourself in that room staring at the gore of slaughter. I wouldn't be terribly surprised if in that dark hovel, two letters on the wall were missed.

                                The good news is that the photgraph preserved them for us so we don't have to debate endlessly whether they exist or not!
                                Iconoclast

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