Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

What happened to Lechmere after Kelly?

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • What happened to Lechmere after Kelly?

    Morning all,

    long time lurker but haven't been on in a while unfortunately.

    Could I ask, what happened to Lechmere/Cross after the Kelly murder - if it was him, I couldn't believe he just stopped of his own accord?

  • #2
    Hi Marc,

    I suspect the answer will be revealed here very soon.

    https://m.youtube.com/channel/UCrXgAUoOgcqTAvQzyJNNL7w

    Gary

    (You may notice a strange tapping sound at the start of part two. It puts me in mind of a blind man tapping his way along a street.)
    Last edited by MrBarnett; 06-17-2020, 10:09 AM.

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by evertonmarc View Post
      Morning all,

      long time lurker but haven't been on in a while unfortunately.

      Could I ask, what happened to Lechmere/Cross after the Kelly murder - if it was him, I couldn't believe he just stopped of his own accord?
      Hi Everton
      some beleive he didnt but went on to kill the victim known as Pinchin torso, Alice McKenzie and Elizabeth Jackson.

      even if not, some serial killers have been known to stop of there own accord, although it is very rare.
      Last edited by Abby Normal; 06-17-2020, 12:55 PM.
      "Is all that we see or seem
      but a dream within a dream?"

      -Edgar Allan Poe


      "...the man and the peaked cap he is said to have worn
      quite tallies with the descriptions I got of him."

      -Frederick G. Abberline

      Comment


      • #4
        duplicate
        "Is all that we see or seem
        but a dream within a dream?"

        -Edgar Allan Poe


        "...the man and the peaked cap he is said to have worn
        quite tallies with the descriptions I got of him."

        -Frederick G. Abberline

        Comment


        • #5
          Same is before, he led a normal respectable life as a carman, with nothing eventful happening in his life, eventually retiring to run a corner shop.
          dustymiller
          aka drstrange

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by evertonmarc View Post
            Morning all,

            long time lurker but haven't been on in a while unfortunately.

            Could I ask, what happened to Lechmere/Cross after the Kelly murder - if it was him, I couldn't believe he just stopped of his own accord?
            Most likely Jack didn’t stop. He was caught, identified and watched, moved or died. Most bring up the argument that serial killers sometimes stop killing. They don’t. In Some cases there are “breaks” due to life changes, distractions or fear of getting caught. They may stop if they’re too old to continue or they go to a different form of violence such as rape. Very, very rarely has a serial killer just stopped and lived a mediocre or comfortable life and never committed another act of violence. Of course this is hard to verify for unknown serial killers. Some say the Zodiac stopped but since we don’t know who he was that can’t be verified.

            Lechmere, as I’ve maintained, is a good person of interest, but it’s doubtful given his lifestyle and where he ended up in life that he was the ripper. That doesn’t mean he should be entirely discounted as some suggest. He’s as good as any other suspect out there.

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by Columbo View Post

              Most likely Jack didn’t stop. He was caught, identified and watched, moved or died. Most bring up the argument that serial killers sometimes stop killing. They don’t. In Some cases there are “breaks” due to life changes, distractions or fear of getting caught. They may stop if they’re too old to continue or they go to a different form of violence such as rape. Very, very rarely has a serial killer just stopped and lived a mediocre or comfortable life and never committed another act of violence. Of course this is hard to verify for unknown serial killers. Some say the Zodiac stopped but since we don’t know who he was that can’t be verified.

              There are hundreds of strings of serial murder that are unsolved cases, many of them old ones where the originator today would be a very old man if he is still alive. Do you think that all of these are cases where the killer kept on killing up until his 93:rd birthday, or died young or was incarcerated for other reasons? I don´t, and one of the reasons for this is Joseph James DeAngelo, the Original Night Stalker. He is 74 today, and his last murder was committed back in 1986, 34 years ago.
              As men grow older, the sex drive tapers off and once it does, the urge to kill will do so alongside it for those in that particular branch. DeAngelo is a prime example, but there will be others. Now that we can catch them through DNA registers, we will see more examples of retired serial killers, living their lives in much the same way as DeAngelo did.
              Hopefully, he will be in-depth interviewed, providing answers to these questions about how serial killers will or will not stop. Until it happens, I remain convinced that not only CAN they do so, they actually WILL do it in many cases.


              Lechmere, as I’ve maintained, is a good person of interest, but it’s doubtful given his lifestyle and where he ended up in life that he was the ripper. That doesn’t mean he should be entirely discounted as some suggest. He’s as good as any other suspect out there.
              No, he is not as good as any other suspect. He is a lot better.

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by drstrange169 View Post
                Same is before, he led a normal respectable life as a carman, with nothing eventful happening in his life, eventually retiring to run a corner shop.
                Much like DeAngelo, I guess, who worked as an appreciated mechanic, a good guy, and who retired to allow him to go fishing and associate with his daughters, an unremarkable life that should fill us all with quiet admiration.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by Abby Normal View Post

                  Hi Everton
                  some beleive he didnt but went on to kill the victim known as Pinchin torso, Alice McKenzie and Elizabeth Jackson.

                  even if not, some serial killers have been known to stop of there own accord, although it is very rare.
                  The perceived rarity, though, has a lot to do with how we only measure it by the amount of serial killers that are caught/identified during their active "careers". If we add the large number of unidentifed and uncaught serial killers, we may be looking at a very different number.
                  Last edited by Fisherman; 07-10-2020, 07:11 AM.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Fisherman View Post

                    No, he is not as good as any other suspect. He is a lot better.
                    Better than most, I agree. As far as Deangelo is concerned, we only have his word his last murder was in 1986. I’m sure the police are looking at cold cases from that point on. DNA didn’t tie him to every crime he committed. Only 8 murders as far as I know. I bet he’s responsible for others.

                    In this case the question put forth, of course any suspect could’ve stopped due to age, infirmary, etc. but with only 7-8 murders suspected or officially attributed to Jack, the comparison to Deangelo’s crime spree is apples to oranges. Deangelo kept going until he could go no further. Did jack after just 7 murders at his age? And since violence didn’t seem to follow Lechmere, unless he changed M.O., I would think that would be in his favor as not being Jack. Anyway that’s off topic for this thread so I’ll stop there. But to answer the thread, he lived a good, decent life.









                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Columbo View Post

                      Better than most, I agree. As far as Deangelo is concerned, we only have his word his last murder was in 1986. I’m sure the police are looking at cold cases from that point on. DNA didn’t tie him to every crime he committed. Only 8 murders as far as I know. I bet he’s responsible for others.

                      There were 13 murders that were committed by what would have been the same man. He has confessed, and he has pleaded guilty to all of them. He may of course have killed more, but not at the age of 74, I´d say. I feel confident that his killing carreer was well behind him when he was apprehended. The idea that serial killers cannot stop is listed as one of sven myths by the FBI, by the way. That should say something!

                      In this case the question put forth, of course any suspect could’ve stopped due to age, infirmary, etc. but with only 7-8 murders suspected or officially attributed to Jack, the comparison to Deangelo’s crime spree is apples to oranges. Deangelo kept going until he could go no further.

                      If he stopped in 1986, how does this apply? Why could he not "go further"?

                      Did jack after just 7 murders at his age? And since violence didn’t seem to follow Lechmere, unless he changed M.O., I would think that would be in his favor as not being Jack. Anyway that’s off topic for this thread so I’ll stop there. But to answer the thread, he lived a good, decent life.
                      I have Lechmere down for a round dozen murders between 1873 and 1889, with clear possibilities of further ones both before and after. It is not as if we know how many he killed.

                      And again, DeAngelo also lived a "good decent life" - or so it was thought. Famous FBI profiler said that the typical sexual serial killer is a man in his thirties, with a steady job and a family. A good, decent man.

                      The problem, of course, is that he only SEEMED to live a decent life. And that too is all we can say of Lechmere. We don´t know if he lived a decent life, only that this is what he at first glance seemed to do.

                      Other people who seemed to live decent lives:

                      Gary Ridgway

                      Peter Kürten
                      Dennis Rader
                      Eric Armstrong
                      Robert Yates
                      Russel Williams
                      John Wayne Gacy
                      Bela Kiss

                      ... and many, many others. Kenneth Bianchi was a security guard, Andrei Tchicatilo was a teacher, Robert Hansen was a baker and so on, seemingly unremarkable people, cogs, as it were, of the great social machinery.

                      Most people who seem to be decent ARE decent. All serial killers who seem to be decent are NOT decent.

                      Last edited by Fisherman; 07-10-2020, 08:20 AM.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        I watched the documentary on Lechmere /Cross and it was very well done. I was not convinced though that this was our man. Too much of it was speculative or circumstantial or even just of passing interest. To me this was a man like Robert Paul.who just happened to pass at that time and has had his name written into the story through pure chance. His explainations at the inquest seem plausible and indeed he even was out money if I remember correctly. There is nothing though which convinces me that Cross was anything other than an innocent man telling the truth.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Columbo View Post

                          Most likely Jack didn’t stop. He was caught, identified and watched, moved or died. Most bring up the argument that serial killers sometimes stop killing. They don’t. In Some cases there are “breaks” due to life changes, distractions or fear of getting caught. They may stop if they’re too old to continue or they go to a different form of violence such as rape. Very, very rarely has a serial killer just stopped and lived a mediocre or comfortable life and never committed another act of violence. Of course this is hard to verify for unknown serial killers. Some say the Zodiac stopped but since we don’t know who he was that can’t be verified.

                          Lechmere, as I’ve maintained, is a good person of interest, but it’s doubtful given his lifestyle and where he ended up in life that he was the ripper. That doesn’t mean he should be entirely discounted as some suggest. He’s as good as any other suspect out there.
                          There is an underlying assumption here that utilizing data acquired from known serial killers,.... identified, prosecuted and then interviewed, has relevance in discussions of murdered street women in 1888 London. Since no-one has ever linked any one Canonical death with another, or any Non Canonical with another, there is no established series here. There is a presumed one, and using very flimsy premises.
                          Michael Richards

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Michael W Richards View Post

                            There is an underlying assumption here that utilizing data acquired from known serial killers,.... identified, prosecuted and then interviewed, has relevance in discussions of murdered street women in 1888 London. Since no-one has ever linked any one Canonical death with another, or any Non Canonical with another, there is no established series here. There is a presumed one, and using very flimsy premises.
                            Very true although I'm not sure about the connections not being established. At least 3 are close enough for consideration and contemporary as well as present day specialists in the field link some of these murders together solidly by MO.

                            As far a Lechmere is concerned, if he did kill Kelly it apparently had no ill effect on his life. It could very well have been an Edward Kemper situation that this killing was what he needed to relieve himself of the demon.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Fisherman View Post

                              I have Lechmere down for a round dozen murders between 1873 and 1889, with clear possibilities of further ones both before and after. It is not as if we know how many he killed.

                              And again, DeAngelo also lived a "good decent life" - or so it was thought. Famous FBI profiler said that the typical sexual serial killer is a man in his thirties, with a steady job and a family. A good, decent man.

                              The problem, of course, is that he only SEEMED to live a decent life. And that too is all we can say of Lechmere. We don´t know if he lived a decent life, only that this is what he at first glance seemed to do.

                              Other people who seemed to live decent lives:

                              Gary Ridgway

                              Peter Kürten
                              Dennis Rader
                              Eric Armstrong
                              Robert Yates
                              Russel Williams
                              John Wayne Gacy
                              Bela Kiss

                              ... and many, many others. Kenneth Bianchi was a security guard, Andrei Tchicatilo was a teacher, Robert Hansen was a baker and so on, seemingly unremarkable people, cogs, as it were, of the great social machinery.

                              Most people who seem to be decent ARE decent. All serial killers who seem to be decent are NOT decent.
                              Actually,many of these lived perverted, sick lives in and outside the family, and most did not stop killing by any stretch. Ridgeway mistreated his wives and girlfriends and still went for prostitutes. He was considered bizarre at his place of work. Kurten was a sick debaucher who never really lived any sort of normal life. he was always hunting for that next thrill. Rader admittedly stopped for a while but said he was ready to start again. Gacy was a drug abusing pervert who was considered a pillar of the community except by those who knew him and he didn't stop killing either. As far as FBI profiling is concerned it also backs up the theory that Jack was stopped and not by personal decision. Profilers Douglas, Ressler, and Hazelwood all said jack was stopped by means other than just deciding he was done and going off to be a success in his life.

                              Going back to Lechmere/Jack the Ripper. Whoever killed Kelly may have stopped, but not by his own decision in my opinion. Lechmere most likely didn't kill Kelly so there was no event in his life that defined it after Kelly's death. He just kept doing what he was doing before she was killed.

                              Comment

                              Working...
                              X