Kosminski and Victim DNA Match on Shawl

[TomTomKent]

The dreaded shawl is back, for the umpteenth time.

Pity it's not a shawl, pity the provenance (such as it is) is merely oral family tradition from a police officer (Amos Simpson) who was in the Metropolitan Police and not the City Police and who has no recorded involvement whatsoever in the Eddowes murder, pity that fairly recent scientific tests on the 'shawl' failed to provide any evidence that what stains were on there were blood at all, pity that the pretty extensive records of Eddowes and her possessions reveal no such item as a shawl at any time, pity that all attempts in the past to 'prove' this was Eddowes 'shawl' failed dismally, pity...

Still, I guess that if you paid a high price for this dubious 'relic' you would be very keen to prove it real. Proving any such thing is totally impossible and, more to the point, hasn't been done. The whole claim is totally, and fatally, flawed.

So even if we took the tests at face value, could we offer alternate explanations for how Kosminski's DNA got there? Such as if the item was never recorded at a crime scene, and Kozminski was a suspect, would a canny copper maybe swipe something from Kozminski as some kind of trophy, in which case his DNA might be expected to be there?

Of course if when he full disclosure of the tests are made they are left wanting (and the photos of other suspects in the mail article including Gull and Prince Eddy really does not fill me with enthusiasm here) the mystery completely falls apart.

I wonder if any DNA tests were performed to tie the shawl to Eddowes herself?

[GUT]

G'day TomTom

I wonder if any DNA tests were performed to tie the shawl to Eddowes herself?

The article says there were.

[eddie1]

Just ordered this book quite excited to read this. But cautious on if I believe it or not. But if this is scientifically proved to be both dna's on the same shawl then for me I think I'd have to believe after all these Years of being gripped by this historical who done it. We may finally have our jack !!

[GUT]

I wonder if any DNA tests were performed to tie the shawl to Eddowes herself?

G'day TomTom

The article says there were.

But then again it says a lot of other things too.

[curious4]

Exactly, GUT, and Mrs Beeton could have told her how to get rid of the stains!
;-)

[PaulB]

Hello Paul. Thanks.

Would that book count as the breaking story? As you rightly point out, the "story" (ie, proper publicity) begins now.

Cheers.
LC

Hi Lynn
I'm just a book watcher but, yes, as far as I am aware it is.

[Svensson]

Morning ladies and gents. Long time reader and first time poster. What an interesting past 24 hours it has been.

I think the whole story stands and falls with the strength of the DNA evidence. If the evidence is correct, it would merely prove that Kosminski was connected to Eddowes. Whether it proves a connection on the night of the murder is a different matter altogether.

Btw, if Eddowes' DNA is found on the garment, then it doesn't matter if it was in the police report or not. The DNA links Eddowes with the shawl.

[DeltaXi65]

As usual, smells like somebody is trying to sell a book.

B

[Phil Carter]

As usual, smells like somebody is trying to sell a book.

B

Hello Delta,

Wise words.


best regards

Phil

[lynn cates]

links

Hello Svensson. Welcome to the boards.

Thousands of others are also linked.

Remember the Sickert business?

Cheers.
LC

[Harry D]

I think comparisons to Sickert & the Maybrick Diary aren't appropriate at this stage. Correct me if I'm wrong but this is the first piece of forensic 'evidence' we've ever had that links victim and suspect, IF of course the DNA testing is reliable.

[pinkmoon]

I just hope this dosnt turn into another saga like the Maybrick diary can't be proved but can't be disproved as we are dealing with science in this case we might have a result on way or the other I just hope it dosnt turn into a he said she said they said debate anyway it's certainly livend things up because as we only saying things have be getting a bit boring on here lately.

[Wickerman]

... The whole story of a policeman taking it home to his wife is ridiculous. In the first place, anything from the crime scene was evidence and no senior policeman would have allowed a junior officer to make off with anything to do with the murder.

That silly idea demonstrates the ignorance involved. The evidence was held by the City police not the Met. so PC Simpson cannot have asked his superiors for permission, they had no control over the evidence.

On top of that I don't recall any mention of a Met. policeman appearing at Mitre Square before the body was removed to Golden Lane.

I can also imagine any wife's reaction to "here you are, dear, nice shawl, took it off a murder victim, just give it a wash to get rid of the bloodstains and it will be as good as new!"

So she threw it out, it lands in the gutter,..then along came Kozminski....

[pinkmoon]

genuine?

If what I've just read in the daily mail is true and the scientific side of it can be independently confirmed then it is case closed you can't argue with hard facts we might have exciting times ahead and please let's keep an open mind.

[pinkmoon]

One thing that might have a massive bearing on this can anyone on here tell me how much this shawl was worth in 1888.