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[clark2710]

Does anyone have a Height, Weight, etc on Kosminski? I can't find how tall he was and appearance

[Ms Diddles]

Does anyone have a Height, Weight, etc on Kosminski? I can't find how tall he was and appearance

Hi Clark, There are notes pertaining to Kosminski's weight and physical health in his records from Colney Hatch Asylum.

[erobitha]

FORM OF DISORDER MANIA Observations Ward 9.B3.10 On admission patient is extremely deluded & morose. As mentioned in the certificate he believes that all his actions are dominated by an ‘Instinct’. Th is is probably mental hallucination. Answers questions fairly but is inclined to be reticent and morose. Health fair.

F. Bryant 1891 Feb 10: Is rather difficult to deal with on account of the dominant character of his delusions. Refused to be bathed the other day as his ‘Instinct’ forbade him.

F. Bryant April 21: Incoherent, apathetic, unoccupied; still has the same ‘instinctive’ objection to the weekly bath; health fair. Wm Seward 1892 Jan 9: Incoherent; at times excited & violent – a few days ago he took up a chair, and attempted to strike the charge attendant: apathetic as a rule, and refuses to occupy himself in any way; habits cleanly. health fair.

Wm Seward Nov 17: Quiet and well behaved. Only speaks German [?Yiddish]. Does no work.

Cecil J. Beadles 1893 Jan 18: Chronic Mania: intelligence impaired; at times noisy, excited & incoherent; unoccupied; habits cleanly; health fair.

Wm Seward April 8: Incoherent; quiet lately, fair health. Cecil J. Beadles Sept 18: Indolent, but quiet and clean in habits, never employed. Answers questions concerning himself.

Cecil J. Beadles 1894 April 13: demented and incoherent, health fair.

C. Beadles April 19th Discharged. Relieved.

Leavesden. Wm Seward

This last note shows that Aaron Kosminski was transferred to the overcrowded Leavesden Asylum near Watford in Hertfordshire in 1894, where conditions were far worse than at Colney Hatch. No reason was given for the transfer, but it is possible that his intractable condition meant that he was never going to be rehabilitated. When he was admitted to Leavesden his bodily condition was noted down as ‘impaired’. For the first time, his mother Golda is listed as his next of kin, her address given as the house where his sister Matilda and her family lived. The sparse notes taken at Leavesden relating to the last years of his life, which were procured for me by the archivist at the LMA, show that his behaviour continued to fluctuate, and later on his physical health also began to deteriorate. The notes below from Leavesden have been compiled from various loose sources in the records and have been arranged in chronological order to give a better sense of Kosminski’s decline:

10/9/10: Faulty in his habits, he does nothing useful & cannot answer questions of a simple nature. BH [bodily health] poor. AKM

29/9/11: Patient is dull & vacant. Faulty & unhealthy in habits. Does nothing useful. Nothing can be got by questions. BH weak. H.C.S.

15/4/12: Didn’t test negative. FH 6/9/12: No replies can be got; dull & stupid in manner & faulty in his habits. Requires constant attention. BH weak. AKM

16/1/13: Patient is morose in manner. No sensible reply can be got by questions. He mutters incoherently. Faulty and untidy in his habits. BH weak. AKM

1/4/14: Patient has hallucinations of sight and hearing, is very excitable and troublesome at times, very untidy, bodily condition fair.

16/7/14: Incoherent and excitable: troublesome at times: Hallucinations of hearing. Untidy – BH fair.

G.P 14/2/15: Pat merely mutters when asked questions. He has hallucinations of sight and hearing and is very excitable at times. Does not work. Clean but untidy in dress. BH fair. DNG.

1/3/15: No improvement. Weight taken on 17 May 1915, 7st 8lb 10oz

1/11/15: Patient has cut over left eye caused by knock on tap in washhouse.

2/2/16: Patient does not know his age or how long he has been here. He has hallucinations of sight and hearing & is at times very obstinate. Untidy but clean, does no work, B.H. good. JM

8/7/16: No improvement. 5/4/17: No improvement. 26/5/18: Patient put to bed passing loose motions with blood and mucous.

27/5/18: Transferred to 8a.

3/6/18: Diarrhoea ceased. Ordered up by Dr. Reese.

28/1/19: Put to bed with swollen feet. Weight in February 1919, 6st 12lb.

20/2/19: Put to bed with swollen feet and feeling unwell. Temp 99°.

13/3/19: Hip broken down.

22/3/19: Taken little nourishment during day, but very noisy.

23/3/19: Appears very low. Partaken of very little nourishment during day.

24/3/19: Died in my presence at 5.05a.m. Marks on body, sore right hip and left leg.

Signed: S.Bennett, night attendant.

[Al Bundy's Eyes]

FORM OF DISORDER MANIA Observations Ward 9.B3.10 On admission patient is extremely deluded & morose. As mentioned in the certificate he believes that all his actions are dominated by an ‘Instinct’. Th is is probably mental hallucination. Answers questions fairly but is inclined to be reticent and morose. Health fair.

F. Bryant 1891 Feb 10: Is rather difficult to deal with on account of the dominant character of his delusions. Refused to be bathed the other day as his ‘Instinct’ forbade him.

F. Bryant April 21: Incoherent, apathetic, unoccupied; still has the same ‘instinctive’ objection to the weekly bath; health fair. Wm Seward 1892 Jan 9: Incoherent; at times excited & violent – a few days ago he took up a chair, and attempted to strike the charge attendant: apathetic as a rule, and refuses to occupy himself in any way; habits cleanly. health fair.

Wm Seward Nov 17: Quiet and well behaved. Only speaks German [?Yiddish]. Does no work.

Cecil J. Beadles 1893 Jan 18: Chronic Mania: intelligence impaired; at times noisy, excited & incoherent; unoccupied; habits cleanly; health fair.

Wm Seward April 8: Incoherent; quiet lately, fair health. Cecil J. Beadles Sept 18: Indolent, but quiet and clean in habits, never employed. Answers questions concerning himself.

Cecil J. Beadles 1894 April 13: demented and incoherent, health fair.

C. Beadles April 19th Discharged. Relieved.

Leavesden. Wm Seward

This last note shows that Aaron Kosminski was transferred to the overcrowded Leavesden Asylum near Watford in Hertfordshire in 1894, where conditions were far worse than at Colney Hatch. No reason was given for the transfer, but it is possible that his intractable condition meant that he was never going to be rehabilitated. When he was admitted to Leavesden his bodily condition was noted down as ‘impaired’. For the first time, his mother Golda is listed as his next of kin, her address given as the house where his sister Matilda and her family lived. The sparse notes taken at Leavesden relating to the last years of his life, which were procured for me by the archivist at the LMA, show that his behaviour continued to fluctuate, and later on his physical health also began to deteriorate. The notes below from Leavesden have been compiled from various loose sources in the records and have been arranged in chronological order to give a better sense of Kosminski’s decline:

10/9/10: Faulty in his habits, he does nothing useful & cannot answer questions of a simple nature. BH [bodily health] poor. AKM

29/9/11: Patient is dull & vacant. Faulty & unhealthy in habits. Does nothing useful. Nothing can be got by questions. BH weak. H.C.S.

15/4/12: Didn’t test negative. FH 6/9/12: No replies can be got; dull & stupid in manner & faulty in his habits. Requires constant attention. BH weak. AKM

16/1/13: Patient is morose in manner. No sensible reply can be got by questions. He mutters incoherently. Faulty and untidy in his habits. BH weak. AKM

1/4/14: Patient has hallucinations of sight and hearing, is very excitable and troublesome at times, very untidy, bodily condition fair.

16/7/14: Incoherent and excitable: troublesome at times: Hallucinations of hearing. Untidy – BH fair.

G.P 14/2/15: Pat merely mutters when asked questions. He has hallucinations of sight and hearing and is very excitable at times. Does not work. Clean but untidy in dress. BH fair. DNG.

1/3/15: No improvement. Weight taken on 17 May 1915, 7st 8lb 10oz

1/11/15: Patient has cut over left eye caused by knock on tap in washhouse.

2/2/16: Patient does not know his age or how long he has been here. He has hallucinations of sight and hearing & is at times very obstinate. Untidy but clean, does no work, B.H. good. JM

8/7/16: No improvement. 5/4/17: No improvement. 26/5/18: Patient put to bed passing loose motions with blood and mucous.

27/5/18: Transferred to 8a.

3/6/18: Diarrhoea ceased. Ordered up by Dr. Reese.

28/1/19: Put to bed with swollen feet. Weight in February 1919, 6st 12lb.

20/2/19: Put to bed with swollen feet and feeling unwell. Temp 99°.

13/3/19: Hip broken down.

22/3/19: Taken little nourishment during day, but very noisy.

23/3/19: Appears very low. Partaken of very little nourishment during day.

24/3/19: Died in my presence at 5.05a.m. Marks on body, sore right hip and left leg.

Signed: S.Bennett, night attendant.

Cheers Ero, nice job.

[erobitha]

Cheers Ero, nice job.

Just a copy and paste job, but I'll take the credit anyway

[clark2710]

Hi Clark, There are notes pertaining to Kosminski's weight and physical health in his records from Colney Hatch Asylum.

I looked at the national records and couldn't find record of him. Then again I may be using the site incorrectly. I search thoroughly on line and couldn't find anywhere where Kosminski's Height and Weight are described. Mind you I skimmed through a lot and may have missed it but I did look pretty well I'd think

[clark2710]

Cheers Ero, nice job.

How can a man such as this be the Ripper? According to this he refused to bathe and honestly there'd produce a funk about you the likes of which would be noticeable to women of the night. He mutters to himself, has hallucinations, and on and on....he's not an easy person to deal with put simply. It would be hard for me to believe that a prostitute would so easily go with a man like this. The only thing i can think of would be that he has a whole 'nother side to himself that cleans up really really well.

[Al Bundy's Eyes]

How can a man such as this be the Ripper? According to this he refused to bathe and honestly there'd produce a funk about you the likes of which would be noticeable to women of the night. He mutters to himself, has hallucinations, and on and on....he's not an easy person to deal with put simply. It would be hard for me to believe that a prostitute would so easily go with a man like this. The only thing i can think of would be that he has a whole 'nother side to himself that cleans up really really well.

Well, seems unlikely. I was thanking Ero for condensing the reports.

Kos circa 1891, yes, highly unlikely. Maybe not in 1888? Mental health is a fragile thing.

I don't have Kosminsky down as the killer, Erobitha certainly doesn't.

Were you looking for descriptions to prove or disprove Aaron?

[clark2710]

Well, seems unlikely. I was thanking Ero for condensing the reports.

Kos circa 1891, yes, highly unlikely. Maybe not in 1888? Mental health is a fragile thing.

I don't have Kosminsky down as the killer, Erobitha certainly doesn't.

Were you looking for descriptions to prove or disprove Aaron?

honestly I would love to get a height, weight, and general description of the man. I can't find anywhere that says he was This tall, and this fat or thin, or what have you. I have been told that it's in the asylum notes and such but I can't find them

[Ms Diddles]

I looked at the national records and couldn't find record of him. Then again I may be using the site incorrectly. I search thoroughly on line and couldn't find anywhere where Kosminski's Height and Weight are described. Mind you I skimmed through a lot and may have missed it but I did look pretty well I'd think

Hi Clark,

Erobitha kindly posted the notes which I was referring to.

They seem to pertain to his (rapidly decreasing) weight and general health, but no mention of height.

Unfortunately I can see no reason why there would be any references in existence to his appearance (and mental state) in Autumn 1888, as Koz was merely another face in the Whitechapel crowds.

[clark2710]

Hi Clark,

Erobitha kindly posted the notes which I was referring to.

They seem to pertain to his (rapidly decreasing) weight and general health, but no mention of height.

Unfortunately I can see no reason why there would be any references in existence to his appearance (and mental state) in Autumn 1888, as Koz was merely another face in the Whitechapel crowds.

Well yeah but I was looking to see how feasible a Ripper suspect he really is and the first place I wanted to start was his height.