Jack the Ripper At Last? by Helena Wojtczak

[HelenaWojtczak]

If it was ever proved that I was related to JtR I think I would react in the same way, as far as I would not feel responsible for crimes that I had not committed but would accept that that was a very interesting part of my family tree.
At least, that's how I think I would react. How would you?

Just wanted to pick up on what Amanda wrote (above).

When my book "Jack the Ripper at Last" was getting close to being finished, about 4 months ago, I received an email out of the blue from a woman who had only just found out that she was George Chapman's great grand-daughter.

It had come as an enormous shock to her, and her niece, who also contacted me. They had absolutely no idea. Chapman's two grandsons had changed their family surname back in the 1950s and 1960s, swapping Polish for English names.

The way they found out was, someone offered to do their family tree, and using the usual official records on Ancestry found her way to Seweryn Klosowski... and someone on another tree had named him as AKA George Chapman.

What a way to find out! The two family members then did internet searches, and found out the horrible truth about Chapman's murders. One of the sites they found was mine, and they emailed me.

Both have just bought copies of my book. Of course when writing I had no idea if any of his descendants would read the book, and it's making me feel a little weird too, knowing they will be reading not only about the three murders but about the speculation about his libido and his performing illegal abortions. If this had been MY g-grand-dad, I am not sure I would WANT to know all this stuff.

Helena

[Amanda Sumner]

The latter is quite likely, given the demographic that then prevailed, but perhaps not all of his customers were Eastern Europeans. Besides, it probably didn't take much of a grasp of English to attend to the tonsorial needs of the working-class. A few grunts seem to do the trick, if my own barber is anything to go by!

Anyhow, it's a safe bet that the chap seen conversing with Annie Chapman and Catherine Eddowes wasn't asking them if they wanted some "things for the weekend" or a short-back-and-sides.

Think you should change your barber, Sam. whenever I go to the hairdressers it usually turns out to be a good therapy session. For both of us. Who needs counselors?
I'm sure the chap was not discussing those things with either Annie or Catherine but I'm sure that any lack of the English language did not prevent a foreigner to convey what he did want with these women, so that puts an end to the argument, really, that Chapman, or anyone else, can be dismissed on the grounds of his age or lack of communication skills.
That leaves us with description then and I have not read a description yet that matches Chapman to a tee. He had a striking appearance, I think, that could not be mistaken, with his prominent moustache, dark colouring and eyes.
It can only ever be speculation really, but what is irrefutable is that Chapman went on to kill three women later on in his life, by poison, without any obvious motive or reason why. Maybe he enjoyed the power over life and death of these poor unfortunates. Certainly there is no doubt in my mind that he was a sadist.

[Sam Flynn]

He was already working as a barber then, though, so one would think Chapman had learnt to communicate with his clients, unless those clients were foreigners too.

The latter is quite likely, given the demographic that then prevailed, but perhaps not all of his customers were Eastern Europeans. Besides, it probably didn't take much of a grasp of English to attend to the tonsorial needs of the working-class. A few grunts seem to do the trick, if my own barber is anything to go by!

Anyhow, it's a safe bet that the chap seen conversing with Annie Chapman and Catherine Eddowes wasn't asking them if they wanted some "things for the weekend" or a short-back-and-sides.

[Amanda Sumner]

Hi Sam,

But there is a debate about that regarding the fact that as a fellow speaker Wolff would have no reason to speak to him in anything other than those languages.

But do we know whether Wolff himself could speak English at that time? Certainly he could later when in court but if he also only spoke Yiddish and Polish in 1889ish then he would only have conversed in those languages.

I haven't had time to check anything so it may be a simple answer.

regards,

It is highly probable that Chapman knew very little English when he arrived in London and surely, even if Levisohn could speak fluent English, what could be more natural than to speak in a more familiar tongue, especially when Chapman had only been in this country a short time before they first met? He was already working as a barber then, though, so one would think Chapman had learnt to communicate with his clients, unless those clients were foreigners too.

[Sam Flynn]

But there is a debate about that regarding the fact that as a fellow speaker Wolff would have no reason to speak to him in anything other than those languages.

True but, presumably, Levisohn would have been able to witness Klosowski dealing with customers in the barber shop.

But do we know whether Wolff himself could speak English at that time?

He'd certainly had plenty of time to pick up the lingo, Tecs. At Klosowski's trial, Levisohn says that he'd lived in England since the early 1860s - albeit he returned to Poland for a stint of national service in the 1870s, coming back to London when his duty was done. A Wolff "Levitison" [corrected to "Levisohn" on Ancestry.com] can be found living at St Pancras in the 1881 Census.

[Amanda Sumner]

interesting activity Rob-thanks.
Reiterates that age is not very reliable, and as I said before Chapman may have simply looked older anyway.

My main problem with Chapman is that most of the witnesses heard the suspect speak and none of them describe a man with an accent, which Chapman surly
had.

Well, I think Chapman can be challenged for other reasons than his age for being the Ripper. The point is he can't, or others, be dismissed for being too young. It's clear that witness's are unreliable when it comes to guessing someone's age except be able to recognise someone who is young, old or middle aged.
The photo on Helena Wojtczak's book cover was taken, I believe, at his arrest when he was, what, about 38 years old? There are several photos of him taken several years apart and he looks the same in every single one. The point I'm making is that some people age at different rates and there is nothing to say that Chapman, for example, did not dress and sport the same moustache way back in 1888.
I'm not saying he is our man, I don't think he is, but I think Helena will be exploring these very things in her book and giving a very factual account of Chapman's own life and crimes.

[Tecs]

Not only that but, according to Wolff Levisohn, Chapman couldn't speak English when he first knew him in 1888/89, only Polish and a biseleh Yiddish.

Hi Sam,

But there is a debate about that regarding the fact that as a fellow speaker Wolff would have no reason to speak to him in anything other than those languages.

But do we know whether Wolff himself could speak English at that time? Certainly he could later when in court but if he also only spoke Yiddish and Polish in 1889ish then he would only have conversed in those languages.

I haven't had time to check anything so it may be a simple answer.

regards,

[Sam Flynn]

My main problem with Chapman is that most of the witnesses heard the suspect speak and none of them describe a man with an accent, which Chapman surly had.

Not only that but, according to Wolff Levisohn, Chapman couldn't speak English when he first knew him in 1888/89, only Polish and a biseleh Yiddish.

[Abby Normal]

My own guesses, incidentally, were
35
15
40
30

So I overestimated pretty much everyone, except the teenager.

Rob

interesting activity Rob-thanks.
Reiterates that age is not very reliable, and as I said before Chapman may have simply looked older anyway.

My main problem with Chapman is that most of the witnesses heard the suspect speak and none of them describe a man with an accent, which Chapman surly had.

[robhouse]

My own guesses, incidentally, were
35
15
40
30

So I overestimated pretty much everyone, except the teenager.

Rob

[Amanda Sumner]

I can't say that the clothes particularly influenced me when guessing their ages in these photos. In those days people dressed, generally, very similarly whether old or young. The quality of the cloth depicted quite often their status in life. I studied their faces which gave me a better idea to guess how old they were, which was a far longer time than any of the witness's had then. I agree with Varqm that they all look rather jaded and depressed with life, except number 2 but I don't see much merriment there either.

[Ally]

Exactly Steve.

[Steve S]

Strangely, I made the three I got wrong all two years older than actual age........But how much of that was the preconception that people then "dressed older", whereas today we "dress younger"?

[Varqm]

Hi Rob,

3 and 4 I was far-off. I made a fast 5-7 seconds calculation. They look so sad and experienced. Number 3 went through a lot. Number 4 look like an old burdened woman.Number 2 look like he had a good somewhat merry life.

I thought I was good.

[Amanda Sumner]

Thank you Rob for an interesting experiment which also supports my statement that it is almost impossible to ascertain someone's age, especially when only getting a glimpse in poor street lighting! I agree that clothes and speech can give away some clues and of course how someone moves or walks can help.
So, in theory, we could have had a young 23 year old on the loose in 1888....