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Can George Chapmam reform himself to being a calculating poisoner seven years later?.

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  • Originally posted by Fisherman View Post
    Just because he lived in the area, that change will not become easier to bridge.
    And, as I've said, we don't even know that for certain. Or, if he did, precisely when he arrived.
    Kind regards, Sam Flynn

    "Suche Nullen" (Nietzsche, Götzendämmerung, 1888)

    Comment


    • Originally posted by Sam Flynn View Post
      And, as I've said, we don't even know that for certain. Or, if he did, precisely when he arrived.
      Why not? He was probably at a party the same evening as when Tabram was killed, an hours walk away. We also know he had to be out of Poland before Nov 1887 when his passport expired.
      Bona fide canonical and then some.

      Comment


      • Originally posted by Batman View Post
        If JtK wanted to murder his partners he wouldn't rip them up would he?
        What was to stop him from ripping up others? Why no Ripper murders in Hastings, Tottenham or The Borough? Or around the West India Dock Road, for that matter, where we can at least locate him during 1888.
        Kind regards, Sam Flynn

        "Suche Nullen" (Nietzsche, Götzendämmerung, 1888)

        Comment


        • Originally posted by Batman View Post
          Why not? He was probably at a party the same evening as when Tabram was killed, an hours walk away. We also know he had to be out of Poland before Nov 1887 when his passport expired.
          Doesnt place him in Whitechapel, though, does it? Or even England, for that matter. If he sailed from Hamburg, as many Poles did, he might have spent some time in Germany before heading off to London. The earliest we can place him in London with any certainty is 1888, when he stayed for some months with the Radins, and nursed their child, in West India Dock Road.
          Kind regards, Sam Flynn

          "Suche Nullen" (Nietzsche, Götzendämmerung, 1888)

          Comment


          • Originally posted by Sam Flynn View Post
            What was to stop him from ripping up others? Why no Ripper murders in Hastings, Tottenham or The Borough? Or around the West India Dock Road, for that matter, where we can at least locate him during 1888.
            Same reasons why he didn't rip his partners. If there were ripper murders in the areas he moved to next then he is done for. That would be an easy catch. Offender lived in all the areas. Narrows it well down.
            Bona fide canonical and then some.

            Comment


            • Originally posted by Sam Flynn View Post
              And, as I've said, we don't even know that for certain. Or, if he did, precisely when he arrived.
              I know that - I was speaking about our knowledge that he did live in Cable Street somewhere around this time. As you say, he may have been too late there to dovetail with the C5 series.

              Comment


              • Originally posted by Sam Flynn View Post
                What was to stop him from ripping up others? Why no Ripper murders in Hastings, Tottenham or The Borough?
                Because he was poisoning people.

                Originally posted by Sam Flynn View Post
                Or around the West India Dock Road, for that matter, where we can at least locate him during 1888.
                There was a murder close to Cable Street

                Comment


                • Originally posted by Batman View Post
                  If JtK wanted to murder his partners he wouldn't rip them up would he?

                  That would be a dead give away WHO JtR is

                  He HAS to change MO and Signature if he wants to murder them.

                  There you have it.

                  A solid reason why JtR could turn poisoner. Precisely because he NEEDS to change MO due to his association with the targets.

                  Ta-da.

                  Should have been more obvious.

                  Explains why BTK didn't kill his targets because he was working in the area. He would be a potential candidate. Putting him on the map for the BTK crimes.
                  But poisoning them - three of them! - wasn´t a giveaway...? When he had learnt that there were victims with no ties at all to him in abundance on the streets?

                  Ta-da indeed.

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by Batman View Post
                    Same reasons why he didn't rip his partners. If there were ripper murders in the areas he moved to next then he is done for. That would be an easy catch. Offender lived in all the areas. Narrows it well down.
                    How on earth would the police have tracked him down - wait for the 1901 census, perhaps, and read through all the paper files? What was to stop him committing Ripper murders before he got to Whitechapel in the first place? Plenty of prostitutes out Poplar way.

                    And since when did criminas stop offending just because they'd moved elsewhere? Doesn't happen even now, with all our sophisticated databases, surveillance and policing techniques.
                    Kind regards, Sam Flynn

                    "Suche Nullen" (Nietzsche, Götzendämmerung, 1888)

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by Fisherman View Post
                      But poisoning them - three of them! - wasn´t a giveaway...? When he had learnt that there were victims with no ties at all to him in abundance on the streets?

                      Ta-da indeed.
                      Ripping his partners would have been obvious. So that ends why he didn't rip them.

                      Poisoning isn't supposed to give away murder let alone he was JtR. He didn't expect to be caught. Obviously, he was hoping no association to murder would be made at all, let alone JtR.

                      So no it wasn't a giveaway and even though he was caught, you still don't think he is a candidate for JtR, so it would have worked with you and many others apparently.
                      Bona fide canonical and then some.

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by Sam Flynn View Post
                        How on earth would the police have tracked him down - wait for the 1901 census, perhaps, and read through all the paper files? What was to stop him committing Ripper murders before he got to Whitechapel in the first place? Plenty of prostitutes out Poplar way.

                        And since when did criminas stop offending just because they'd moved elsewhere? Doesn't happen even now, with all our sophisticated databases, surveillance and policing techniques.
                        Police tracked down plenty of people for ripper inquiries, even around the world, out as far as America. The idea that they couldn't isolate who was living in those areas at the times is not something I can believe, given the work they did in the contemporary.

                        We don't know if Chapman killed more or not.

                        Chapman didn't stop offending when he moved, did he?
                        Bona fide canonical and then some.

                        Comment


                        • if that customer hadn't walked in when he was assaulting his wife in America and he had stabbed her to death, what would be saying about his validity as a ripper suspect then?
                          "Is all that we see or seem
                          but a dream within a dream?"

                          -Edgar Allan Poe


                          "...the man and the peaked cap he is said to have worn
                          quite tallies with the descriptions I got of him."

                          -Frederick G. Abberline

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by Abby Normal View Post
                            if that customer hadn't walked in when he was assaulting his wife in America and he had stabbed her to death, what would be saying about his validity as a ripper suspect then?
                            If the story about the knife is true, of course. There's a contradictory version on the police files which said that it was a revolver, not a knife. Helena Wojtczak makes some interesting comments on the whole matter in her book.

                            Assuming for the sake of argument that he had stabbed her to death, then we'd have a domestic knife murder on our hands. Hardly ripperesque, and we'd still be left with a man who can't be definitively placed anywhere near the epicentre of the Ripper murders in 1888.
                            Kind regards, Sam Flynn

                            "Suche Nullen" (Nietzsche, Götzendämmerung, 1888)

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by Sam Flynn View Post
                              and we'd still be left with a man who can't be definitively placed anywhere near the epicentre of the Ripper murders in 1888.
                              What happened to him being a party on the same night Tabram's was murdered one hour walk away?
                              Bona fide canonical and then some.

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by Batman View Post
                                Police tracked down plenty of people for ripper inquiries, even around the world, out as far as America. The idea that they couldn't isolate who was living in those areas at the times is not something I can believe, given the work they did in the contemporary.
                                They didn't catch him, though, did they? It wasn't by any means axiomatic that the police would get their man, so why would a confident open-air Ripper suddenly retreat into his shell just because his postcode had changed? Not that they even had postcodes back then - never mind databases, surveillance or modern policing techniques.
                                We don't know if Chapman killed more or not.
                                I was referring to Ripper murders. If anything remotely Ripper-like had happened in Hastings, Tottenham, The Borough or Poplar, we'd have got to know about them.
                                Chapman didn't stop offending when he moved, did he?
                                Quite. So why would Chapman-as-Ripper stop ripping?
                                Kind regards, Sam Flynn

                                "Suche Nullen" (Nietzsche, Götzendämmerung, 1888)

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