Hutchinson and antisemitism ?? A possibility?

[Fleetwood Mac]

Hi Macca

You mean if you were in those two situations that is what you would do?

How can you possibly predict the train of thought of George Hutchinson? Had the ouija board out?

Observer

I'm not.....I'm saying that is the logical answer...no matter the person.

But this a bit rich Observer....considering your trail of thought.....which starts with "could have been lying"....and is the basis for "major suspect".

[Observer]

Hi Macca

If he did it.....then he'd be thinking: "go to the police and if someone saw me going into the room then I'm well and truly goosed".

If he didn't do it....then he'd be thinking: "go to the police and there ain't a problem because I didn't go in the room - I didn't kill her - so there's no way I can get fingered for this".

The evidence doesn't point to H....nor does logic.

You mean if you were in those two situations that is what you would do?

How can you possibly predict the train of thought of George Hutchinson? Had the ouija board out?

Observer

[Fleetwood Mac]

Had Hutchinson not come forward,the obvious suspect would have been the man Cox says entered Kelly's room,in her,(kelly) company.

Surely Hutchinson coming forward suggests it wasn't him.

If he did it.....then he'd be thinking: "go to the police and if someone saw me going into the room then I'm well and truly goosed".

If he didn't do it....then he'd be thinking: "go to the police and there ain't a problem because I didn't go in the room - I didn't kill her - so there's no way I can get fingered for this".

The evidence doesn't point to H....nor does logic.

[Fleetwood Mac]

Hi Hunter,

Very unlikely, indeed.

Amitiés,
David

Really?

Some graffiti about Jewish citizens which did not in any way shape of form mention murder or murder sites must be linked to a series of murders becase some apron was found underneath?

I find the opposite. I'd estimate there's a small chance that it had anything to do with the murders.

I feel you two may be in on your own joke here - but this doesn't seem the site for it.

[bolo]

Hi,

As for Hutchinson, his actions are clearly consistent with those of an innocent man who realised he could be thought to be the murderer of MJK.

I don't really believe that Hutch is our man but his detailed testimony still gives me headaches. If he only wanted to clear his name, a less colorful story would have been enough.

He said that he had read news of the murders to Mary Kelly so he knew about the huge press echo and journalists who bustled about the East End in search of new stories. Perhaps he wanted to get his 15 minutes of fame just like Packer.

Regards,

Boris

[Fleetwood Mac]

Personnely I would not put too much faith in Aberline's expressed belief in Hutchinson.Initially he may have done so,but there seems to be a complete lack of stated belief after the report of that evening.
As to Blotchy being a better bet than Hutchinson on account of being placed in Kelly's room,it seems at odds with a belief in Hutchinson's sighting of Kelly at 2AM on Commercial ST,in the company of another man,who also went to her room..You cannot have it both ways Fleetwood.

A man seen going into her room is not a better bet than the testimony of a man who may or might not have been lying...and were he telling the truth Hutchinson didn't see him going into her room?

It's not what you perceive that counts.....it's what happened.

[Abberline2]

All well and good, except that Hutchinson claimed to have informed a policeman of his meeting with Kelly and her encounter with the Jewish-looking suspect. Since this was said to have occurred on the Sunday, the day before the Sarah Lewis story received its first public airing, Hutchinson was either lying or he wasn't 'sweating it out'.

Garry Wroe.

But equally, as you say, Hutchinson could have been lying simply to give the impression that he had not waited until after the inquest - he must have known it was a question that he would obviously be asked by the police once he had come forward. He may simply have been adding yet another lie to make it appear that he had indeed come forward before the inquest when in all probability he had done no such thing.

[Abberline2]

I admire your enthusiasm Ruby ! It would be interesting to know how common horseshoe tie pins were at that time. Maybe Hutchinson's description was ficticious and based on someone he knew or had seen elsewhere who was connected in some way with horses. Then again, the pin could have been worn merely as a good luck symbol and not have anything to do with the horse owning/breeding/racing fraternity at all.

Given the savage nature of the mutilation of MJK and the fact that being in MJK's room the killer could take his time as he went about the killing, I would have thought that blood would have easily soaked through any pieces of clothing he may have used to protect his own clothes and, indeed, have soaked through onto his own clothing. The idea that he used the clothes to protect his own just doesn't seem very likely.

As for Hutchinson, his actions are clearly consistent with those of an innocent man who realised he could be thought to be the murderer of MJK.

For me, in the midst of all the 'ifs' and 'maybes' he doesn't come over as a credible candidate for the mantle of JTR.

[Abberline2]

If there were clothes in the room, I think that he would of used them for protection, even if he also wanted light & heat.

Personally, I don't believe in the letters being genuine -but I think that the graffito was chosen, if not written, by JtR.

If that was the case why only use and burn Mrs Harvey's bundle and not MJK's as well ?

[DVV]

In fact, the "hand" of the GSG has been described (round school boy machin chose), and hardly matches that of the FH letter. Which proves nothing either way, of course.

Amitiés Greg,
David

[GregBaron]

Graffiti...........

What I believe was pointed out by Mr. Wroe, in his superb essay, was that the same sort of grammatical ignorance was displayed in the Ghoulston street graffiti and the Lusk letter. Too bad someone didn't photograph the graffiti, if the hand and poor grammar seemed to match, this would lend greater credence to each as being from JTR................


Greg

[The Good Michael]

I know this is a bit off topic, but I'd like to point out one other thing about the Graffiti that seems to get overlooked.... It was small... in other words, each letter was written to fit into the height of a brick ( which is about 2 inches). Most graffiti written on walls is much bigger than that; so as to state from a distance " Here I am! Look at me". This particular writing was likely not to be legible until you got close... like bending down to pick up a bloody apron.

Hunter,

We spoke of this a lot in the past, and you and I are on the same page with that. Graffiti is generally flamboyant and not neatly written in a round schoolboy's hand. Surely it meant something where it was located. As for when it was written, I believe it was written before going out that night, and it may have not been written by the Ripper, just read and liked by him.

Mike

[Garry Wroe]

(sorry Garry, to write like that -it's because I'm making the effort to not be controversial).

Not at all, Ruby. The point I was trying to make, however, concerns the dichotomy between the apparent official rejection of Hutchinson's claims and Abberline's belief that Jack the Ripper was a Jewish-looking suspect lookalike. It's something of a paradox to my way of thinking.

On an altogether different note, I would caution against the automatic dismissal of the opinions of men such as Abberline. They were there, in the thick of it, and had information to which we are simply not privy.

Garry Wroe.

[Hunter]

I know this is a bit off topic, but I'd like to point out one other thing about the Graffiti that seems to get overlooked.... It was small... in other words, each letter was written to fit into the height of a brick ( which is about 2 inches). Most graffiti written on walls is much bigger than that; so as to state from a distance " Here I am! Look at me". This particular writing was likely not to be legible until you got close... like bending down to pick up a bloody apron.

I've been told before by folks how illogical it is for a killer, fresh from 2 kills, maybe, to take a chance such as the apron/graffiti message, but I've read about stranger things being done by known serial killers. Anyone who kills a woman and nearly gets caught in the process; then goes a little ways off and kills another in a public square where police patrols are less than 15 minutes apart is not acting logically anyway.

He was very lucky.

[Garry Wroe]

Hutchinson didn't come forward until after the inquest but perhaps he was just sweating it out. It was not until the inquest heard the evidence of Sarah Lewis that Hutchinson would have known he could possibly be identified as having been standing by the entrance to Millers Court shortly before the murder appears to have taken place. Until the inquest, he may have been hoping that no-one would come forward to say he was there or, indeed, not known anyone would give such evidence at the inquest.

All well and good, except that Hutchinson claimed to have informed a policeman of his meeting with Kelly and her encounter with the Jewish-looking suspect. Since this was said to have occurred on the Sunday, the day before the Sarah Lewis story received its first public airing, Hutchinson was either lying or he wasn't 'sweating it out'.

Garry Wroe.