Hutchinsons statement....

[Wickerman]

Ok sorry. Those nuances are missed sometimes when written.
In terms of his wording being suspiciously similar to what was in the papers, earlier in this thread and in previous threads direct comparisons are made and they're to similar to be coincidence in my opinion. "The murdered woman Kelly" etc. is one I remember Off hand.

How does that work Abby?

"I'll rehearse phrases already published in the press, and commit them to memory, to make my story more believable"????

Hutchinson can't put a simple phrase together now?

[Sam Flynn]

I've not seen a paper which includes the exact wording of his statement but if you can show me one that does I'll concede that he probably cribbed it.

Papers, plural, and not exactly exact. However, a case could be made for his having elaborated on previous press reports.

[Abby Normal]

I speak only for myself and my post was tongue-in-cheek as I'm sure you must realise. Opinion is divided over Hutchinson, as in so much else on this forum.



I've not seen a paper which includes the exact wording of his statement but if you can show me one that does I'll concede that he probably cribbed it.

Ok sorry. Those nuances are missed sometimes when written.
In terms of his wording being suspiciously similar to what was in the papers, earlier in this thread and in previous threads direct comparisons are made and they're to similar to be coincidence in my opinion. "The murdered woman Kelly" etc. is one I remember Off hand.

[Bridewell]

whose "we". good lord. are you speaking for all of casebook???
i swear people lose all sense of sanity when speaking about hutch.

I dont say it, thats for sure.

the other witness descriptions are detailed enough-whats not detailed about Cox or Schwartz description for example-its just they went no where because no one knew who they were looking at. and the police never had a strong enough suspect to compare it with. and London has a lot of people.

I dont dismis hutch just because its too detailed-but also because its the nature of the detail. The script like events, an amalgam of previous supects along with over zealous claims to be able to recognize the man.
He may have even cribbed the exact wording of his statement from the papers.

added to that he waits until inquest is over-3 days later-plenty of time to perfect his story-to come forward.

Hog wash.

I speak only for myself and my post was tongue-in-cheek as I'm sure you must realise. Opinion is divided over Hutchinson, as in so much else on this forum.

He may have even cribbed the exact wording of his statement from the papers.

I've not seen a paper which includes the exact wording of his statement but if you can show me one that does I'll concede that he probably cribbed it.

[Abby Normal]

Hutchinson is one of two witnesses I feel sorry for.

On the one hand we say what a shame it is that nobody ever got a close enough look at JtR to give us a detailed description. On the other we dismiss Hutchinson's account because his description is too detailed.

whose "we". good lord. are you speaking for all of casebook???
i swear people lose all sense of sanity when speaking about hutch.

I dont say it, thats for sure.

the other witness descriptions are detailed enough-whats not detailed about Cox or Schwartz description for example-its just they went no where because no one knew who they were looking at. and the police never had a strong enough suspect to compare it with. and London has a lot of people.

I dont dismis hutch just because its too detailed-but also because its the nature of the detail. The script like events, an amalgam of previous supects along with over zealous claims to be able to recognize the man.
He may have even cribbed the exact wording of his statement from the papers.

added to that he waits until inquest is over-3 days later-plenty of time to perfect his story-to come forward.

Hog wash.

[Bridewell]

Yes, some members have tried to make a case for Hutchinson using a few details from a handful of press reports to create his story. Which is a funny position to take, as if anyone needs to read the papers to "invent" a well-dressed man. However, the more unique details like gaiters, horse-shoe tie-pin, Astrachan collars & cuffs, thick gold chain with red seal, etc., are nowhere to be found in print, associated with the victim, over that weekend.

So we are supposed to believe Hutchinson was too dumb to come up with a "well-dressed" character of his own, but then had sufficient imagination to give this man some very noticeable accoutrements.
Sounds like another silly idea to me.
Some people are so desperate to have him pictured as a liar they invent these ridiculous scenario's.

Hutchinson is one of two witnesses I feel sorry for.

On the one hand we say what a shame it is that nobody ever got a close enough look at JtR to give us a detailed description. On the other we dismiss Hutchinson's account because his description is too detailed.

[DJA]

Are you David Anderson?

Does he live on some Australian mountain range?

[Wickerman]

Ok Wickerman cheers
I was simply wondering because I hadn't seen a witnes statement purporting seeing a "Well dressed man" before Hutchinsons on the 12th

Yes, some members have tried to make a case for Hutchinson using a few details from a handful of press reports to create his story. Which is a funny position to take, as if anyone needs to read the papers to "invent" a well-dressed man. However, the more unique details like gaiters, horse-shoe tie-pin, Astrachan collars & cuffs, thick gold chain with red seal, etc., are nowhere to be found in print, associated with the victim, over that weekend.

So we are supposed to believe Hutchinson was too dumb to come up with a "well-dressed" character of his own, but then had sufficient imagination to give this man some very noticeable accoutrements.
Sounds like another silly idea to me.
Some people are so desperate to have him pictured as a liar they invent these ridiculous scenario's.

[Scott Nelson]

Are you David Anderson?

[DJA]

It's never been clear who broke open the door.. some sources say the police, other sources (including McCarthy) say it was him.

McCarthy and his son attended Abberlines' retirement party? I didn't know that. I'm behind on my reading.

I'll stick with George Bagster Phillips' testimony at the inquest.

Apart from a press report of J. McCarthy and son at the Three Nuns,it is mentioned in A-Z.

[andy1867]

Ah, ok.
Well that story is placed about 10:30 Thursday night, and you can read it in the Star, or Daily News of 10th Nov.

Ok Wickerman cheers
I was simply wondering because I hadn't seen a witnes statement purporting seeing a "Well dressed man" before Hutchinsons on the 12th

[Wickerman]

Simply because that's the newspaper I saw the statement in on 10th Nov
If it's in others fair enough
But I was simply saying I couldn't see a witness report before Hutchinsons that said Kelly was with a well dressed man, and simply asking if someone could point me to it.
I wasn't actually GOING anywhere

Ah, ok.
Well that story is placed about 10:30 Thursday night, and you can read it in the Star, or Daily News of 10th Nov.

[andy1867]

It's not easy to understand where you are going with this.
My first question would be, why use the New York Tribune?

Simply because that's the newspaper I saw the statement in on 10th Nov
If it's in others fair enough
But I was simply saying I couldn't see a witness report before Hutchinsons that said Kelly was with a well dressed man, and simply asking if someone could point me to it.
I wasn't actually GOING anywhere

[Wickerman]

Going back to Hutchinsons statement regarding the dress of the man he saw with Kelly...and he didn't give evidence until the 12th of November...
In the press reports...The New York Tribune on the 10th of November states
"It has been learned that a man, respectably dressed, accosted the victim and offered her money. "
Have I missed a statement by someone else?
All i can find is "Blotchy faces and shabbily dressed"....
It also states
"The murdered woman told a companion last evening that she was without money"
Its by no means beyond belief that I'm talkin' utter b...lx...but luckily that hardly mithers me

It's not easy to understand where you are going with this.
My first question would be, why use the New York Tribune?

[Scott Nelson]

McCarthy broke open his own door for the police, when he knew he could simply reach in the window.
He and his son attended Abberline's retirement party.

It's never been clear who broke open the door.. some sources say the police, other sources (including McCarthy) say it was him.

McCarthy and his son attended Abberlines' retirement party? I didn't know that. I'm behind on my reading.