Duke of Bedford

[DJA]

Well they addressed him as Lord Lewes.

Possibly William Nevill.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/William_Nevill,_1st_Marquess_of_Abergavenny

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Francis_Russell,_7th_Duke_of_Bedford

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Francis_Russell,_9th_Duke_of_Bedford

All Knights of the Garter.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lord_William_Russell

[Errata]

Ok. The Earl went to the castle. He attacked his uncle there and held a knife on his brother. The family left the castle and refused to return if he was still there. He's called the Earl of Lewes and Lord Lewes. With all due respect, this sounds like a primary family member, not 'one of the kids'. Based on a newspaper that was in the case file, I date this at around 1882. In the later case files of 1887, the name is now Hon William Russell. Aren't they all connected to the Nevill family?

No you're right. I hate this stuff, but now I'm curious.

I don't have what you have, so I'm going on the information you give.

I can't find a connection between the Russells and the Nevills right off the top. Different areas, different titles, a couple hundred miles apart as best I can tell. So It's not a situation where Bedford is Lewes, or Bedford goes to the older and Lewes to a younger kind of thing.

There may be a marriage I'm missing, but if there is, clearly I'm missing it. And all noble families are to an extent related, at least a little.

There's a William Nevill who is the 2nd Marquess of Abergavenny and the first Earl of Lewes. He's a bit old for the dates you mentioned. But his first son was Reginald who never married, which is usually a red flag. He seems a bit young for the ages you mentioned, but is within that range I guess.

There is a line of the Russell family that are th Amberleys. Is it possible someone confused Amberley for Abergavenny? It seems unlikely.

I have no idea why they would call a Nevill a Russell. But the Earl of Lewes is definitely a Nevill, not a Russell.

Unless they checked him under a false name to distance themselves, but it seems unsporting to use another noble family's name.

Is it possible that the early institutionalization was in fact a Nevil, and then there was a Russell? Two different patients?

[SuspectZero]

No you're right. I hate this stuff, but now I'm curious.

I don't have what you have, so I'm going on the information you give.

I can't find a connection between the Russells and the Nevills right off the top. Different areas, different titles, a couple hundred miles apart as best I can tell. So It's not a situation where Bedford is Lewes, or Bedford goes to the older and Lewes to a younger kind of thing.

There may be a marriage I'm missing, but if there is, clearly I'm missing it. And all noble families are to an extent related, at least a little.

There's a William Nevill who is the 2nd Marquess of Abergavenny and the first Earl of Lewes. He's a bit old for the dates you mentioned. But his first son was Reginald who never married, which is usually a red flag. He seems a bit young for the ages you mentioned, but is within that range I guess.

There is a line of the Russell family that are th Amberleys. Is it possible someone confused Amberley for Abergavenny? It seems unlikely.

I have no idea why they would call a Nevill a Russell. But the Earl of Lewes is definitely a Nevill, not a Russell.

Unless they checked him under a false name to distance themselves, but it seems unsporting to use another noble family's name.

Is it possible that the early institutionalization was in fact a Nevil, and then there was a Russell? Two different patients?

Good. At least someone here is intrigued. I just gave everyone information that was not available before on a stated person of interest and hardly anyone is paying any interest.
Yes 2 people - that's definitely a possibility. I can actually point everyone who reads this post directly to the records I've seen. They are finally online but not obvious to many.
Specifically the actual patient case files for the Manor House Asylum in Chiswick. This locale is supposedly the rumored launching point for Monty's final dip in the Thames and was the final mailing address for his insane Mom, Ann Druitt.
Oh how I miss the most excellent, Chris Scott.

[Rosella]

Reginald Nevill never married but his siblings did and none of them married into the Russell family. Reginald was Earl of Lewes between 1876 when his father became Ist Marquess of Abergaveny) and 1915, when he succeeded his father. He seems a bit of a nonentity compared to a couple of his brothers who had quite distinguished careers, but he was a lieutenant in the West Kent Yeomanry in 1873 and became Justice of the Peace for West Kent in 1880.

On the other hand the Amberley Russells had mental illness in their family. Bertrand Russell, the philosopher, apparently put off having children for a long time as his grandmother, Countess Russell, warned him there was 'a strain of madness' in the family. Bertrand's parents died young but of the three siblings of Viscount Amberley, (Bertrand's father) all were either mentally ill or incapacitated as adults. I haven't been able to find out a thing about the second son, the Hon George William Gilbert Russell (1848-1933) other than he was unmarried.

[Rosella]

Later,

Apparently George William Gilbert went mad in 1874. Like others in his family he was apparently regarded as odd and eccentric. He seemingly regarded practical jokes that were played on him by fellow army officers as persecution. Could he have been the aristo who pulled a knife on his brother and was incarcerated at the Manor House Asylum in Chiswick?

Hons are the younger sons of Earls, Viscounts and Barons. It's a courtesy title.

[drstrange169]

>> At least someone here is intrigued. I just gave everyone information that was not available before on a stated person of interest and hardly anyone is paying any interest.<<

Close to 2,000 views so far!

Most, I suspect are like me, following with interest but, have nothing worthwhile to add at the moment.

Keep up the good work.

[SuspectZero]

>> At least someone here is intrigued. I just gave everyone information that was not available before on a stated person of interest and hardly anyone is paying any interest.<<

Close to 2,000 views so far!

Most, I suspect are like me, following with interest but, have nothing worthwhile to add at the moment.

Keep up the good work.

Well my fellow forum members I hand you the keys to the case histories of the patients of the Manor House Asylum. If you can decipher the doctors handwritten notes, you will find the case files of the Doctors Tuke. Here you will find detailed notes on Ann Druitts last days, the Hon. William Russell and the dangerous and mysterious lunatic, the Earl of Lewes. Some of these are incredibly boring, but others are pretty interesting.
I look forward to hearing what you find and hoping one of you discovers something remarkable. Click the 'View Online' button to read any of these records.
Have fun:

http://search.wellcomelibrary.org/iii/encore/search/C__SManor%20house%20asylum__Orightresult__U?lang=eng&suite=cobalt

[drstrange169]

Interesting stuff to search through.

I don't feel so bad about my bad handwriting now;-)

[Errata]

Good. At least someone here is intrigued. I just gave everyone information that was not available before on a stated person of interest and hardly anyone is paying any interest.
Yes 2 people - that's definitely a possibility. I can actually point everyone who reads this post directly to the records I've seen. They are finally online but not obvious to many.
Specifically the actual patient case files for the Manor House Asylum in Chiswick. This locale is supposedly the rumored launching point for Monty's final dip in the Thames and was the final mailing address for his insane Mom, Ann Druitt.
Oh how I miss the most excellent, Chris Scott.

Are there two names in the same patient file? Like on the same piece of paper? Can I see these? I'm actually kind of amazed the files are available. I'm so attuned to modern mental health care that the idea that confidentiality isn't a thing for these patients is novel.

never mind I see you posted it.

[SuspectZero]

Are there two names in the same patient file? Like on the same piece of paper? Can I see these? I'm actually kind of amazed the files are available. I'm so attuned to modern mental health care that the idea that confidentiality isn't a thing for these patients is novel.

never mind I see you posted it.

Hi Errata,
See my last post. Search to your hearts delight. To answer your question directly, they are two separate entries in 2 different case history books.
These have not been available to the general public until recently so lots to discover.

[Errata]

sweet mother of god.

my whole family is in medicine and my eyes are still crossing.

[DJA]

Those Tuke brothers leased Chiswick House from the 9th Duke of Devonshire.

That was it's second address after moving from the original Manor House.

[SuspectZero]

sweet mother of god.

my whole family is in medicine and my eyes are still crossing.

Yeah. Isn't it awesome?

[Errata]

Yeah. Isn't it awesome?

masochist...

[Errata]

Well on first read there is a traumatic brain injury/ stroke which is not a mental illness, and they knew it wasn't. Anyone know if the asylum was also for invalids?