Top Jack the Ripper Suspects

[GUT]

To Gut

Fair enough, but I was looking at it from the perspective of the end of Edwardian Era, e.g. when opinions have settled.

By then or thereabouts Swanson has written the Marginalia and Littlechild has expressed the opinion, to Sims, that Tumblety had never been cleared of suspicion

In 1913 and 1914 Macnaghten committed himself to the publicly un-named Druitt as not only the best suspect, but the only one worth mentioning--because to him he was the one.

G'day Jonathan

But that's why I'd be inclined to swap your 2 and 3.

[J6123]

1. Anonymous (had a mental illness, was paranoid and delusional, was maybe guided by a voice)

2. Aaron Kosminski

3. David Cohen

Kosminski and Cohen are my two chosen suspects, with Kosminski being the stronger suspect of the two. I am not saying I think Kosminski was the Ripper, just that he is a good suspect compared to others, based on Anderson and Swanson, and what we have learnt about him.

The case against David Cohen is weak and circumstantial, but i would say the case against many others is non existant. [PHP][/PHP]

[Jonathan H]

To Gut

Fair enough, but I think that Tumblety is a much, much stronger suspect than Aaron Kosminski.

This is because he was a police suspect in 1888, Scotland Yard wanted samples of his handwriting from both coasts of the US, they sent Inspector Andrews to do a background check on him in Canada, and his ambiguous shadow falls across the subject in the Edwardian era:

George Sims' certainty that it was a middle-aged doctor; his 1907 claim that the second-best theory is that of an American; Littlechild's letter to Sims in which he has been told by somebody that the doctor has taken his own life; his initial 'exoneration' because of the McKenzie and Coles murders; and finally his own bombastic interview of 1889 in which he provides no alibis whilst admitting he knows the East End very well.

Kosminski has nothing going for him on this scale and, arguably, has much against him. Her does not even enter the extant record as a Ripper suspect until 1894 (by a senior police officer who ultimately utterly rejected him) and not by the senior cop who advocated him until 1895.

The same could be said of Druitt because he was already deceased and Mac was reliant on second-hand evidence. I believe this evidence came from the man to whom Druitt had confessed, but it was still harder to quantify than a living suspect (nonetheless, Macnaghten, at some risk to his own career, committed himself to a suspect who was, to some extent, his own reflection staring back at the Old Etonian -- rather than a local nonentity or an Irish-American scoundrel).

[J6123]

I think that Tumblety is a much, much stronger suspect than Aaron Kosminski.

Tumblety was apparently homosexual. Why would somebody commit serial sexual murder against the sex they aren't interested in? This, and other things, possibly makes him an even weaker suspect than Kosminski.

[Jonathan H]

To J6123

Fair enough, and I personally do not think Tumblety was the killer -- because Sir Melville Macnaghten did not. Alone among the Victorian police he would not have been impressed with the homosexual angle, e.g. such a vile creature would be capable of anything.

On the other hand, Tumblety was not just gay but reportedly a misogynist, though he himself denied this (for what his denial was worth).

[Abby Normal]

That's interesting, Abby. I don't think I've ever seen Harry Bowyer put forward as a suspect. Maybe I haven't been around long enough?

He discovered the body what any detective worth his salt would take a look at and also said he saw her a day before her murder. Was ex military like a large percentage of serial killers are. Local man, would have known Mary's recently single condition as mcarthys lackey as well as her broken window as a way to get into her room.
Debra arif recently discovered a direct newspaper quote where he said he was in the court the night she died.

So put that in your little laughing emoticon and smoke it and read up on the less known articles of the case Einstein. : )

[GUT]

He discovered the body smart ass what any detective worth his salt would take a look at and also said he saw her a day before her murder. Was ex military like a large percentage of serial killers are. Local man, would have known Mary's recently single condition as mcarthys lackey as well as her broken window as a way to get into her room.
Debra arif recently discovered a direct newspaper quote where he said he was in the court the night she died.

So put that in your little laughing emoticon and smoke it and read up on the less known articles of the case Einstein.

Boy somebody's tetchy today.

[Mayerling]

I actually never had a real choice candidate - I always felt totally unable to make such a choice because, despite all the wonderful finds that were good finds of evidence in this case I feel that at this late date we can never be perfectly sure.

That said, I am most interested in reading Jonathan's future book on Druitt and Macnaghten. I tend to find Jon has been doing some fascinating research into Sir Melville's use of his information from 1891 through 1914. Because (at the time Jon first began bringing this forward) I was reading a book dealing with a similar change of "testimony"/"commentary" by another party involved in another famous historical subject ("the Titanic Disaster") I found Jon was probably on the right track.

Though I feel sorry even now for Montie (that suicide still gets me), I will grant he is the best candidate for being the Ripper.

After him it is anyone's guess. The brouhaha over the Kosminski book and it's questionable use of DNA has sort of put that gentleman aside for the time being (in my mind) as a serious candidate. Pity because he shared that list with Montie, and Ostrog as the three chief suspects (as far as Macnaghten actually listed any by name).

I find that instead of picking names of the best candidates I concentrate on the ones I find personally interesting in their own right:

1) Montie,
2) Dr. Tumblety (because of his possible connection with the Lincoln assassination and definite connection to the American Civil War)
3) D'Onston Stevenson (because of his interest in the occult - a big subject in Victorian England, even more than now).
4) Bury - of the murderers that have been suggested (Deeming, Cream, Chapman, Holmes, Mrs. Pearcey) Bury was technically first and interested some police involved in his case, as well (apparently) as his hangman, James Berry.

There is one curious thing nagging at me. When they had that "Royal Conspiracy" theory centered around Prince Eddy, they suggested the killings were actually perpetrated by the Royal physician Sir William Gull. Actually Gull was one of several Royal physicians to Victoria, Prince Bertie / Edward VII, and other leading royals. Another one was Sir James Reid, for example. But I mentioned on one of these threads a doctor fully as notable in the 1880s as Gull, who definitely is known to have been interested in crime, and is associated with a famous quip concerning the "Pimlico" Poisoning Case of 1885-86 regarding Edwin and Adelaide Bartlett. Mrs Bartlett was acquitted due to the brilliant courtroom work of her barrister Sir Edward Clarke. Afterwards, the surgeon, Sir James Paget, said, "Now that we know she is innocent, and cannot be tried again, in the interest of science she should tell us how she did it!!" Paget's family loved to discuss mysteries - his son John Paget wrote an excellent 1860 book called "Puzzles and Paradoxes" dealing with cases like Eliza Fenning, and Elizabeth Canning. The book (which I read in college) was actually up-to-date for the time, as John Paget mentions the case of James Mullins (hanged in 1860 for the murder of a Mrs. Elmsley) in passing in one of his chapters. That suggest crime was discussed in the Paget circle. It doesn't mean that it was not discussed in Gull's family, but there is a clearer path of involvement with Paget's family. I'm curious about what Paget was up to in 1888, and how his health was (Gull had had a stroke).

Jeff

[David Andersen]

1. Montague Druitt

[GUT]

1. Montague Druitt

Montie's getting plenty of votes.

Which actually surprises me a little since generally when he's bought up it is ridiculed. "The only reason is the timing of his suicide" seems to be the normal response, but to my mind there's a lot more than that.

[Rosella]

(1) Unknown local who slipped through the net.

(2) Ditto.

(3) David Cohen, who was at least violent, in contrast to Kosminski.

'Indian Harry' could indeed be a suspect.

[Fisherman]

He discovered the body what any detective worth his salt would take a look at and also said he saw her a day before her murder. Was ex military like a large percentage of serial killers are. Local man, would have known Mary's recently single condition as mcarthys lackey as well as her broken window as a way to get into her room.
Debra arif recently discovered a direct newspaper quote where he said he was in the court the night she died.

So put that in your little laughing emoticon and smoke it and read up on the less known articles of the case Einstein. : )

I think we should lend some weight to the fact that Kelly had been dead many hours when Bowyer discovered her. Much as I like the angle of taking a look at those who discover bodies , I think the circumstances must be weighed in too.

The best,
Fisherman

[mechanicalcannibal]

Oh my gosh, thanks to everyone who mentioned their suspects.

I'll tally up the votes, but I see a lot of them being Montague John Druitt, Kosminski was mentioned a bit, the blotchy man who was with Kelly, and Tumblety (who in actuality is one of the suspects I put up in the top, but I wanted to use others opinions, not my own).

Another thing is, I wanted to ask about the Myabrick diaries and what your opinion is on them. I looked into the diaries and I'm sketchy about them.

Kaitlyn

[Harry D]

He discovered the body what any detective worth his salt would take a look at and also said he saw her a day before her murder. Was ex military like a large percentage of serial killers are. Local man, would have known Mary's recently single condition as mcarthys lackey as well as her broken window as a way to get into her room.
Debra arif recently discovered a direct newspaper quote where he said he was in the court the night she died.

So put that in your little laughing emoticon and smoke it and read up on the less known articles of the case Einstein. : )

Thanks for elaborating. In future, you might want to ditch the 'tude.

[Abby Normal]

Thanks for elaborating. In future, you might want to ditch the 'tude.

Actually was trying to be funny/sarcastic. Sorry.