Was the Artist Henri de Toulouse Lautrec Implicated in the Killings?

[lynn cates]

impressionist pun

Hello Gale. Thanks for clarifying. I note that,

"A number of posters seem to have got the same wrong impression."

Now you must watch out for Robert. He'll make a pun out of "impression."

Cheers.
LC

[Bridewell]

Henri the Ripper



Here he is: Astrakhan Man in all his glory.

[Phil Carter]

Brilliant Bridewell!

Excerpts from the Dali Diary Memorandum I see. This has never been published in full you know... there is rumour to be another version.. or two..
One by Whistler's close relative, a sewing machine manufacturer called Singer.
The other by some bloke apparently connected to Mr Whistler called Mr Bean..once seen hanging in a gallery on a wall but this hasn't been seen since the 1990's and is thought now to be lost.

kindly

Phil

[Bridewell]

Hi Galexander.

I'm being rather less than charitable. Welcome to the Boards. You will, inevitably I think, encounter a great deal of scepticism in advancing Henri de Toulouse-Lautrec as a JtR suspect.

You'll need to show that he was in London at the material time, that he had at least a passing familiarity with the East End, that he (or at least someone answering his description) was seen there. You'll also need to establish a motive and to show that, despite his limitations, he was physically capable of a series of brutal murders. I think you're up against it, frankly, but please prove me wrong on this.

Regards, Bridewell

[Limehouse]

A number of posters seem to have got the same wrong impression.

I am not of the opinion that HTL committed the murders in person or even that he knew they had happened. He was handicapped and had a problem walking very far.

What I do suggest however is that his doctor, Henri Bourges, may have been a possible candidate. During the months in question he was notably absent from HTL's side.

Hello Galexander, welcome to the site.

Don't you think this doctor was going beyond his duty to his client - ie going out and slaying the women/woman he felt was responsible for his client's illness. i mean, did he do this for all of his syphillitic patients? seems a bit implausible to me.

Also, with respect, I am getting a little tired of the theory that the women were slayed for spreading syphillis. It seems an often repeated motive and some theorists even seem to imply it was a justifiable motive. I don't have any sympathy with it. For a start, I am sure their clients knew the risk they were taking when they went with the women and were therefore at least partly responsible for getting infected, and secondly, why don't we have any examples of prostitutes going out and slaying the men responsible for infecting them in the first place?

[mariab]

Were there any Ripper murders in Paris while Lautrec was resident there

Actually, there were. Any time now someone's gonna come out and accuse Toulouse-Lautrec (or his doctor) of the French torso murder. :-)

"A number of posters seem to have got the same wrong impression."
Now you must watch out for Robert. He'll make a pun out of "impression."

There's minimalist Ripperology, suspect-centered Ripperology, and of lately, the sub-field of impressionist Ripperology.

[Robert]

Lautrec scores over a man with no legs at all.

[mariab]

Or just a torso as a suspect for both the London and the Paris torso murders.

[Bridewell]

Gaugin!

And just incase that isnt enough..

Gaudin cannot have been Mary Kelly,, because..

She was still living in 1889...For one example, see HTL's 'Red-Headed Woman Sitting in the Garden of M. Forest' 1889

kindly

Phil

Hi Phil,

Perhaps it was Gaugin then, not Gaudin! He could have done Stride, leaving Van Gogh free to see to Eddowes, with Toulouse coming into the frame later when he came up Commercial Street on stilts and gave MJK a fit of the giggles.

[Bridewell]

Legless

Lautrec scores over a man with no legs at all.

He does, but Lautrec was alcoholic, so probably legless much of the time.

[galexander]

And just incase that isnt enough..

Gaudin cannot have been Mary Kelly,, because..

She was still living in 1889...For one example, see HTL's 'Red-Headed Woman Sitting in the Garden of M. Forest' 1889

kindly

Phil

Carmen Gaudin and Lautrec parted company quite some months before 1888.

Some of the quoted dates of these paintings may be misleading as they may refer to the date they were first publicly viewed. Some paintings were also completed in the studio by Lautrec quite sometime after the original sketch had been made.

[galexander]

Hi Galexander.

I'm being rather less than charitable. Welcome to the Boards. You will, inevitably I think, encounter a great deal of scepticism in advancing Henri de Toulouse-Lautrec as a JtR suspect.

You'll need to show that he was in London at the material time, that he had at least a passing familiarity with the East End, that he (or at least someone answering his description) was seen there. You'll also need to establish a motive and to show that, despite his limitations, he was physically capable of a series of brutal murders. I think you're up against it, frankly, but please prove me wrong on this.

Regards, Bridewell

How many times do I have to tell you?

I have already made it clear that I don't think Lautrec carried out the killings in person or even knew for certain that they had happened.

Now will you listen?

What about his doctor Henri Bourges? See Lautrec's own painting of him:

[Sally]

Looks like Astroman to me. I'm sold.

[galexander]

Hello Galexander, welcome to the site.

Don't you think this doctor was going beyond his duty to his client - ie going out and slaying the women/woman he felt was responsible for his client's illness. i mean, did he do this for all of his syphillitic patients? seems a bit implausible to me.

Also, with respect, I am getting a little tired of the theory that the women were slayed for spreading syphillis. It seems an often repeated motive and some theorists even seem to imply it was a justifiable motive. I don't have any sympathy with it. For a start, I am sure their clients knew the risk they were taking when they went with the women and were therefore at least partly responsible for getting infected, and secondly, why don't we have any examples of prostitutes going out and slaying the men responsible for infecting them in the first place?

But the big difference here is that Lautrec was descended from Toulouse nobility, hence his name.

Also Lautrec's family had both influence and money. They were also perhaps a little over protective towards their son whose handicap had resulted from inbreeding. Lautrec's mother and father were cousins.

[sleekviper]

The good doctor would be killing at the wrong end of the spectrum. If anyone is to blame for the conditions that Henri, and others in that class for ages, were to suffer, it was those led by greed. The Charles II of Spain type were born from the greed of keeping money in the family; incest is the problem, and thus the enemy someone would want to kill. A guy born with numerous health problems, drinking heavy because of those problems and constant ridicule of his physical handicaps, and the doctor would blame whom? I would expect rich males with titles coming to unexplained ends than poor females just trying to live another day. If he is killing over an injustice, the root begins with relatives bearing children with one another for the sake of money and titles, but that is just my take on it.