can anyone verify likelihood of this....?

[perrymason]

thank you all for your responses!

i did not know the ripper was believed to be left handed...i think that is also very interesting...i am just wondering why this information would come in connection to the case...the dates certainly fit from what i have researched on the net just now but i agree...unlikely candidate

You better hold on to your horses Nell, cause the only murder that might give us indications that he was left handed is Mary Jane Kelly's, the last. The killer may well have been right handed, or ambidexterous...the second less likely, ....and remember, we have five victims linked by opinion, not by evidence.

But he wasnt the Elephant Man, nor was he Mr Mansfield of the Lyceum fame. Thats all Ive ruled out so far...but Im only in this a few years yet.

I think after a few more years or decades you get to rule out Victoria Regina too...which will be a relief.

Cheers

[psychicnell]

and another thing.......

Where does 'stonemason' come into it? The only connection that i can find is Flemming (having just looked through this site) so could Michael Davitt be passing his belief that Flemming was responsible? There is currently not enough to go on but it is food for thought...also would Anderson and Davitt share the opinion that they had their man and he was in an asylum ....did Flemming end up in an asylum?

All too confusing but I can only 'say what i see' and hope you knowledgable types can shed light!

[perrymason]

......I'm sure that each and all of these people were keenly interested in what was happening in Whitechapel and saw it as a societal problem.

Hi Joan,

I captured that bit because what they felt included abandonment. They felt the middle and upper classes wanted to keep them in this ghetto, with police that were acting according to Charles Warren, a military man, more like guards to ensure the East End residents didnt spill over to the "good" parts of the city.

And within months.....what happens? Dramatic killings of the hopelessly poor and indigent, causing the entire world to scoop up news of the killings in Whitechapel.

Its one of the millions of "ironic" coincidences of this story. They craved attention and help....and the Ripper killings advanced plans for Urban renewal and much was done for that area in the next few years.

I cant help but think Jack was in Trafalgar Square the year before.

Best regards.

[Geister]

Well this is random. In Ireland Davitt is considered a hero...in the strongest possible terms (streets named after him, statues etc.). My simple offering is that Davitt was certainly an emphatic person, and I cannot imagine him holding back information on the case. He would certainly have been on the side of the women.

[Geister]

[perrymason]

and another thing.......

Where does 'stonemason' come into it? The only connection that i can find is Flemming (having just looked through this site) so could Michael Davitt be passing his belief that Flemming was responsible? There is currently not enough to go on but it is food for thought...also would Anderson and Davitt share the opinion that they had their man and he was in an asylum ....did Flemming end up in an asylum?

All too confusing but I can only 'say what i see' and hope you knowledgable types can shed light!

Not one of the ones mentioned above, kinda a newbie myself, I can tell you that Joe Flemming was indeed institutionalized for life. He had a congenital predisposition to it apparently, I believe a few of females in his family tree were also in asylums, I think one committed suicide.

But add that to his address at The Victoria Working Mens Home, literally almost at the centre of the "spree"....and he keeps getting more interesting. Didnt Mary say the other Joe sometimes would "be mean" to her to Julia at #1 Millers Court?

Best regards.

[psychicnell]

I agree...from what i have read it seems unlikely but like I said I am passing it on as I have recieved it. Is it possible he knew and that JTR was incarcerated in an asylum as Anderson had suggested?

[psychicnell]

Curious....feels very wrong accusing people who could very well be innocent! Stonemason is the only keyword that really connects him though ... I will remote view again....the danger is that now I have done some research on the topic i will not trust the info that comes.

[psychicnell]

Sorry to be demanding but I have just noticed 'portland' came up in my insights and after researching michael davitt I thought it was conected to his time in portland prison but there appears to be a connection to flemming and his stonemasonry on this site......is there a valid connection or does this just serve to prove that you can make anything fit if you try hard enough!?

[Sam Flynn]

Fleming was a mason's plasterer, rather than a stone-mason, Nell... although one could extend that to speculating that, working in the building trade, he'd have been familiar with Portland Cement. Then again, so would many others, including casual labourers - of which there were several thousands living in the East End.

[Pippin Joan]

A complete sideline...

Hello again, Nell!

This is totally off the Ripper topic (I hope). I was messing around on the computer, looking up census information in an attempt to find out where my great-grandfather was from. All I knew was that he was born around 1866 in England, emigrated to America with his brother George, married, had my grandfather, and died at 24. I found the only brothers with those names, born in those years, and they were from the cotton mill area of Rossendale, Lancashire. I looked up that town, and what do I see, but that's where poor little Michael Davitt lost his arm in the cotton mill! Don't you just love these coincidences, whether they're insignificant or not?

Don't give up hope on the psychic research. We Ripper enthusiasts sometimes feel we have so little new to sink our teeth into -- this list cheers me up!

[psychicnell]

Thank you for your support pippin joan...and yes that is a coincidence! I scribbled the list on the back of an envelope after a five minute 'remote viewing'....I will do it again in more depth and post up what I find...you never know...I have stopped reading anything about the ripper now in case I take in information without realising it. I hope I can come up with something useful and hope I am not just a bit loopy!

[Suzi]

Why does a psychic need Google?

For unforseen events............
Remember seeing a GENUINE sign in a pub in South Wales saying that the Psychic booked couldn't make it owing to 'Unforseen Circumstances'!

Sorry will go back and read psychicnell''s comments.......

OK interesting stuff and if we drop the 'stone' (from and onto the mason)...... maybe we may have something here!

SERIOUSLY though maybe M.Davitt (presuming that the name is correct....(did this name and the other stuff come through clairaudience?)...... may be worth a serious look...this wouldn't be the first case to be given a shove by intervention from 'The Other Side'........I speak -despite the tone as someone who has a lot of time and some experiences various in these matters

Suz x

[Byzantine]

cloak and dagger

Isn't this a bit too vague?. The phrase originates in a genre of drama popular in France and Spain. It was introduced in American English by Henry Wadsworth Longfellow in 1840 and British English by Charles Dickens in 1841.
Depending on the context the meaning is "espionage", "mystery" or "assassination". Well the later two can accurately describe the Jack the Ripper case without obvious relation to any particular individual.

"st lucia"

Saint Lucia "Lucy" of Syracuse is the patron saint of the blind. Her name actually derives from "lux", Latin for "light". Her feast day is 13 December, the longest night of the year in the Julian Calendar (but not in the Gregorian one). Her feast is a major religious day in Sweden where young girls are dressed up as angels, all in white. The saint was killed by stabbing c. 304, during the persecution of Diocletian. She was approximately twenty years old at the time of her death. Late medieval legend reported her eyes being removed prior to her execution, in art she is often depicted as holding her own eyes in a plate.

Her violent manner of death and removal of an organ (her eyes) presents a superficial resemblance to the murders. But, other than partly removing Mary Jane Kelly's eyebrows, the Ripper had no apparent interest in the eyes of his victims. No-one angelic or dressed in white in this case either. Lucia might have some religious significance for Elizabeth Stride but otherwise bares no particular significance for anyone else involved in the case.

December 13 also has no particular meaning as a date in the case. No victim killed on that day. The Julian date for her feast in 1888 was Gregorian "25 December". Also a quiet night for the case.