Where does Joseph Fleming fit into the equation?

[DVV]

Hmm, well the Infirmary staff had three years to correct the height record. So if no-one noticed he was only the same height as every other male in the building, yet his record was a clear foot taller, then just maybe he was the actual height of 6' 7", thats why it was never changed?

Maybe the obvious, is just too close to see clearly?

What is obvious, Jon, is that they had three years to comment on his incredible height and thinness.
They did not.
Nobody did, in fact.

As for the height not being corrected, Ben has already answered that, and quite reasonibly.

[Lechmere]

Ben
It seems not to have registered with you but I was quoting from a variety of records about the Victoria Home with minimal personal addition. You are contradicting those records including Booth's interviews.
Booth did not conduct his interviews in order to advertise the Victoria Home.

[Wickerman]

What is obvious, Jon, is that they had three years to comment on his incredible height and thinness.
They did not.
Nobody did, in fact.

As for the height not being corrected, Ben has already answered that, and quite reasonibly.

Just suppose the staff commented on it every single day for three years....how would you expect know about it today?

[DVV]

Conspiracy

I know, Jon.
Fleming's height was a chilling secret.
Nobody talked about that.
Too dangerous.
And as tall as he was, nobody has ever noticed him around Miller's Court.
An invisible giant, actually.

[Michael W Richards]

I seem to recall one poster suggesting "the other Joe", was Joseph Isaacs, funny enough, he claimed to have visited France too

Im not sure if your taking my suggestion seriously or not Jon, but this Joe Isaacs......(curiously the Berner Street affair may well have had someone with the surname of Isaacs accompany Louis when they sought help, not Isaac K......Louis D, London Evening News, Oct 1, "One of the members named Isaacs came out with me".....just curiously),...this fellow had moved around the corner from Dorset a few days before the murder.....(after Barnett was gone), and he had acted strangely while there. The night of the murder he simply disappears leaving some belongings behind.

Heres a snippet from the Manchester Evening News December 10th:

"The police are continuing their inquiries into the antecedents of Joseph Isaacs, said to be a Polish Jew, who is now in custody on a charge of watch stealing. Mary Cusins, the deputy of a lodging-house in Paternoster Row, near Dorset-street, and Cornelius Oakes, a lodger, state that the conduct of the prisoner was frequently strange. Although he had a violin and four or five other musical instruments, he was never known to play any of them. Oakes says the prisoner used often to change his dress. He heard him threaten violence to all women above 17 years of age."

He was also a cigar maker....curiously, just like some of the folks in the cottages at 40 Berner.

It would seem that at least on the surface, he ticks some qualifier boxes.

Cheers Jon

[Fisherman]

Obviously, not the opinion of a soccer fan

He's famous for his goal scoring abilities, apart from his stats which mention his height, nowhere else do people dwell on this feature, only his fans who chant:
"He's big, he's red, his feet stick out the bed,...".
Even Wiki (all caveats duly noted), fails to bring up his height as anything extraordinary.

... and he played for Tottenham Hotspur, so he´s a great guy in more than one sense.

The best,
Fisherman

[Lechmere]

Indeed fisherman - a salient fact - in suspect based "ripperology' I like to deal in facts and avoid at all costs rubbing out inconvenient bits and pieces. I would deal ashamed to do so.

[Fisherman]

Ben:

Fisherman,

Will you please show some consideration towards other posters and stop using that bold type-face all the time.

No, I really don´t think so.

But not only when you come close to 15. As I've shown from other sources, anyone with a BMI of less than 18.5 (i.e. considerably more than the BMI suggested of Fleming) is advised to consult a doctor.

No - that is untrue -not to call it something else.
If qa person of 201 centimeters weighs 74,6 kilograms, he is listed as being of normal weight. I he looses 100 grams, he enters the mildly thin category - and you think that will have people sent to the doctor? You need a reality check, Ben.

And by the way, anorexia is a disease and not a weight. The people who were vicitmized in concentration camps during the second world war were not anorectic - they were starved. Once fed, they ate all they could. People who are mildly thin - as per the WHO - ALSO eat normally, generally speaking.

One can be 160 centimeters and weigh 100 kilograms and be anorectic. If so, one will refrain from eating and cause bodily harm in the end. That´s anorexia. People who loose 100 grams do not enter the anorectic sphere.

The WHO aren't exactly telling people to seek medical advice only when they start to resemble inmates from Belsen.

No - they recognize that people can have an eating disorder regardless of what they weigh, just as they recognize that some people need to have a high BMI to feel and be healthy, whereas others can have a very low BMI and still be quite healthy - like Peter Crouch, like James Stewart, like Jennifer Aniston.

The WHO regards a BMI of less than 18.5 as underweight and may indicate malnutrition, an eating disorder, or other health problems

Which is exactly what I am saying - underweight MAY indicate malnutrition. That is not at all equal or anywhere near equal to it always doing so.

It is perfectly clear that they regard this category - the "thin" category - as a potential health hazard, and the further down from 18.5, the greater the concern.

Yes, exactly - potentially, all underweight MAY be coupled to malnutrition. It stands to perfect reason. The mildly thin, however ... Nah.

I realise you've run away with the idea that words such as "mild" and "moderate" imply something very trivial and cushy, but they don't mean "mild" and "moderate" in isolation, as we might describe a lazy summer scene by the meadow. They are simply used as part of a grading system for an already extreme group..."

O holy ignorance! How can somesbody who is one gram under normal weight be "extreme"? The terms mildly thin and moderately thin are not my inventions. Nor is the term severely thin. They are the instruments the WHO use.
You somehow seem to think they should be "incredibly dangerously thin", "excruciatingly, incredibly thin" and "lethally thin". What utter, utter rubbish. Tosh!

Why would there not be a category between the dangerously thin and the normal people? Hmmm? Any answer to that one? Do we go from normal via a lost-out snack to be anorectically endangered? Such a suggestion is mildly, ... no moderately ... no SEVERELY senseless.

I don't want to see any more meaningless comparisons with celebrities either, please. They are hopelessly inapplicable, not least because none of them have a BMI index of less than 17.5, which, according to DSM, represents the danger zone. Crouch is 18.2, whereas Fleming was a shocking 17.3 (if we accept the clearly erroneous record as accurate, at least).

There are many, many celebrities who have equally low BMI numbers. James Stewart was exactly a "shocking" 17.3. How shocked have people been by him, I wonder? A leading movie star?

However, he is later listed as being only 11 stone, and yet is still reported as being in "good" bodily health.

Once again, James Stewart was fit as a fiddle. He fought in the great war, he was an actor who made action movies etcetera.

This takes us far beyond the realms of the acceptable.

Yes - which is why you need to stop.

All the best,
Fisherman

[Fisherman]

Ben:

" The criminological equivalent of "WHO" would doubtless observe that while someone like Ronnie Biggs may be "moderately evil", Andrei Chikatilo and Ian Brady are "extremely" so. That doesn't mean Biggs stole a few penny sweets."

Anyone care to answer this gem? I can´t bring myself to do it.

Fisherman

[Fisherman]

Indeed fisherman - a salient fact - in suspect based "ripperology' I like to deal in facts and avoid at all costs rubbing out inconvenient bits and pieces. I would feel ashamed to do so.

In a perfect world, Edward, all would share that sentiment. In Ripperology ... well, that´s anotyher thing altogether. Shamelessness is the order of the day for some. And it´s not hard to see why - it´s either that or acknowledge they have no case.

All the best,
Fisherman

[Fisherman]

Incidentally, have you guys heard who was voted the most beautiful woman in the world by People´s magazine recently? Yep - Gwyneth Paltrow! Gorgeous looking woman!!

... and with a 17.3 BMI, apparently.

You can feast your eyes on her at the site:

http://freewa11papers.blogspot.se/2012/08/wallpaper-gwyneth-paltrow.html

I take it people are shocked and repulsed by this skeleton of a woman too? Guys?

The best,
Fisherman

[lynn cates]

tempest in a tea pot

Hello All. May I observe that this is all a tempest in a tea pot?

1. Yes, I think 5' 7" is more likely, but he may have been 6' 7" for all that.

2. His height has NOTHING to do with his possibly being "MJK's" killer.

Cheers.
LC

[Fisherman]

Hello All. May I observe that this is all a tempest in a tea pot?

1. Yes, I think 5' 7" is more likely, but he may have been 6' 7" for all that.

2. His height has NOTHING to do with his possibly being "MJK's" killer.

Cheers.
LC

THAT is how to put things, Lynn - you don´t posit that it is more probable that he was 5 ft 7, you simply say that YOU think it more likely, you stay away from the "infinitely more likely´s" and all the Bagdad Bob vocabulary and you acknowledge that he may well have been 6 ft 7. Totally neat.

Now, you are a teacher, right ...?

Much as you think it a tempest in a teapot, I´m kind of particular with my tea, see ...

Fisherman

[Fisherman]

Another snippet from the net:

"i am recovering from anorexia. my bmi was 18.5 at its lowest and i gained 1.5 kg througj eating more and doimg the same amount of exersise, i wanted to gain weight gradually and maintain my fitness(i want to run competitively and currently do x-coumtry races). my period has been stopped for about 6 months and i am willoing to let my bmi go up to 20bit my new doctor says no exersise until it gets to 22!"

So: diagnosed with anorexia, but never leaving the "normal" area of BMI. Which is - once again - exactly what I have been saying all along: Anorexia is a disease and not a weight.

Are we getting the hang of that part now? I should hope so.

Can we see the difference between this person and people like James Stewart and Gwyneth Paltrow, perfectly healthy people with 17.3 BMI values, but naturally thin? I hope so too. Cause this is getting kind of stupid.

The best,
Fisherman
finished for the night

[Wickerman]

And as tall as he was, nobody has ever noticed him around Miller's Court.
An invisible giant, actually.

Did anyone ever say he was at Millers Court?