Some info on Lionel Druitt

[Adam Went]

Hey all,

I'm doing a bit of research into Dr. Lionel Druitt and his time practicing in Swansea, Tasmania at the moment (1891-1896) - for those of you who are interested, rather than post the same thing on two different forums, you might like to check out this thread over on JTR Forums:

http://jtrforums.com/showthread.php?p=109104

The research is ongoing and there may be more to add to it soon, so watch this space.....

Cheers,
Adam.

[Adam Went]

I've posted up some new information on the thread on JTR Forums about Dr. Druitt this morning, including a photo of his practice in Swansea, as well as one of the church where he was described as a "lay preacher", amongst some other odds and ends that might be of interest.

Cheers,
Adam.

[Johnr]

Thanks For Sharing, Adam!

Thanks very much for sharing your researches on Dr Druitt and his family Adam.

Good hunting!

Over on JTRforums I have posted a private message to Howard Brown. Asking him to send some of the details to you which I included on Dr Druitt in Swansea.

Back in the 1970's, excited by Daniel Farson's 1973 paperback eponymously titled: ("Jack The Ripper"), I got cracking sleuthing in several states to find just where Dr Druitt and family drifted to. And drifted they did.

Why once, with Mrs Druitt seven months pregnant, they up and left St Arnaud in country Victoria, and never mentioned that they'd been in that town ever again!

My aim was, of course, to be the first to discover Mr Farson's elusive pamphlet ; "The East End Murderer: I Knew Him" written by a Mr Fell and published in Dandenong, Victoria in 1890.

Well, in the end, I was to join the ranks of Irving Rosenwater, Colin Wilson, the BBC, and countless others, in failing to find it.

But the search itself was marvellous. From it I, with the help of stalwart colleagues, dogged Dr Druitt's tracks to every point, and accumulated a rather good picture of the life of a country doctor in Australia one hundred years ago.

Stories a bit like that Martin Clunes series.

Anyway, now I have time, there will be no excuse. Only trouble is Adam's research is on JTRForums, mine is promised to "Ripperologist".
Oh dear!


JOHN RUFFELS.

[Adam Went]

Hi John,

Thanks very much for that! Glad to hear that somebody else has done similar research!

I actually only got roped into it quite recently when I was asked to track down Reg A. Watson's section about the Tassie connection in his Crime Stories book, and then it went on from there and culminated in a trip down to Swansea last week.

I must admit I was pretty excited when I was speaking to the heritage centre curator, who mentioned the word "diaries" lol, but while the information I got was helpful, it was perhaps a bit of a disappointment compared to the calibre i'd built myself up to expect.

That's interesting about his time in Victoria, wasn't aware of that. Anyway, thanks again and best of luck with all of your future researches into him....

Cheers,
Adam.

[lynn cates]

Druitts

Hello Adam and John. You do great work, as always. The Druitts are a fascinating study--intellectually, a mile ahead of most.

Would that they should break the silence and at least discuss the various family traditions/rumours concerning Monty.

Please keep us posted.

Cheers.
LC

[Johnr]

Thanks ForYour Kind Words Lynn, and Adam.

Yes, Lynn, I agree the Druitts are a fascinating study.

Not least because Montague Druitt does not fit the mould of a down-at-heel struggling East End Jewish immigrant.

I long ago posited the theory, it was only after all the (Canonical Five) JTR murders were over and processed, that the police considered a middle class suspect like Druitt.

I know they questioned "respectable" persons lurking in the stews of East London after dark...and frequently seemed to let them go with a touch of the hat and a " Enjoy the rest of your evening, Sir. Sorry to bother you".

So did the Metropolitan police suddenly realise they had been looking in the wrong direction?

Although, they must have considered doctors from the London Hospital et cetera.

I shall definitely pen my story about Dr Lionel Druitt and his Australia family for "Ripperologist"; and also details of my search for the elusive " The East End Murderer:I Knew Him".

Martin Howells and Keith Skinner in their book "The Ripper Legacy" dealt rather well with the Druitt family in Australia, drawing on their own extensive research, supported by that of a Druitt/Mayo family historian.

It was late in the day they decided to contact me, and I gave them the results of all my extensive research.Which they acknowledged.

I was disappointed when they sought to provide a tidy ending to the Fell pamphlet mystery by saying I had overlooked it! That was definitely not the case. And it made me look a bit of a chump. I was not happy!

However, the rest of their book ( except for the improbable ending) was finely researched, and provided valuable information on James Monro and his opinion on JTR.

JOHN RUFFELS.

[lynn cates]

book

Hello John. Then I must obtain that book as I am keen to know Monro's take on all this. Perhaps one may induce the nature of his "hot potato"?

Cheers.
LC

[Adam Went]

Hi Lynn and John,

According to "Montague John Druitt: Still Our Best Suspect" by Andrew J. Spallek (Ripper Notes, July 2005:

Much is made of the "wild goose chase" that occupied Daniel Farson, Martin Howells and Keith Skinner and many others. Briefly, Farson relates the story of a file of his that went missing from Television House in 1959. The file allegedly contained a correspondence from a Mr. A. Knowles describing a document he had seen long ago in Australia titled "The East End Murderer - I Knew Him." Significantly, Knowles had thought that the author of this document was a Lionel Druitt or Drewett. Montague had a cousin named Lionel Druitt who had emigrated to Australia. Extensive research eventually tracked this document down, and it was shown to have nothing to do with Lionel Druitt. The document was merely a supplement in the St. Arnaud Mercury of Nov. 29, 1890. It did not relate to Montague Druitt.

Now I will confess that I was actually secretly hopeful that something of this document might be tucked away amongst the medical records of Dr. Druitt in Swansea, but in truth, none of his medical records are now in existence there - this is not an uncommon thing, only two of the doctors who practiced there during Druitt's era have any significant medical records at all - but nonetheless, there was nothing to be made of it.

So while it would be excellent if John or anybody else could ever make anything more of this document, I tend to think that it might be, like so much else in the Ripper case, a bit of a red herring.

Cheers,
Adam.

[Johnr]

Lets Take A Leaf From A.P.Wolfe's Book...

Hello Lynn and Adam,

Both of your observations and hopes are entirely valid in my opinion.

One of the sad things happening on this marvellous Internet Experiment called "Casebook: Jack the Ripper", is that it is burgeoning: becoming too big.

As the result, people are exploding at others watering down the evidence in favour of their favourite JTR suspect, getting all huffy, and taking their theories elsewhere. Some have moved for other, valid reasons.

Now they can go to Casebook Examiner; Ripper Notes: Ripperologist or JTRForums....

Perhaps we should all do what the legendary, swashbuckling Ripperologist A.P.Wolfe does, and ensure at least one copy of their marvellous research is posted onto a freely accessible site, where all can enjoy the gems of hard-won research .

I am thinking here that I do not subscribe to Ripper Notes, and thus have not read Andrew Spallek's good research on Dr Druitt.

Perhaps there needs to be some kind of Central Directory or Index (or is that called a Search Engine?) where we can all locate relevant articles by other
Ripper researchers?

I have not considered the cost incurred by these researchers in acquiring their information. Some would say surely they are entitled to recoup their expenses by selling their articles? I agree. But how about putting the details on a Central List somewhere?

Or releasing the original for open access after some years have passed?


JOHN RUFFELS.

[lynn cates]

good idea

Hello John. That makes eminent sense to me. It could:

1. cut down on time researching articles previously posted

and

2. cut down on duplication of material.

Good thinking!

Cheers.
LC

[Chris]

Adam

I haven't read Andy Spallek's article, but from what you quote, it sounds as though he had just accepted the "explanation" of the Dandenong Document given by Howells and Skinner, in Ripper Legacy. However, I agree with what John says above. What H and S suggested is no explanation at all. There's no way it could explain what Farson reported of the contents of the letter from Knowles.

I also agree with John about posting material on a freely accessible site. I believe most or all of the Ripper periodicals have said they have no objection to this provided an appropriate period is allowed to elapse after publication. If I understand correctly, for the Examiner, the period is two months. (Accordingly I shall be posting my own small contribution with the new photo of Lawende here in August.)

[Adam Went]

Hi John and Chris,

You, and anybody else that's interested, can read Andy Spallek's article for free online now, here:

http://books.google.com.au/books?id=heo4xyZhDpkC&pg=PA4&dq=Montague+John+Druitt:+Still+Our+Best+Suspect+by+Andrew+J.+Spallek&hl=en&ei=VZsxTM3uL9CLkAWJ4N2CBA&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=1&ved=0CCoQ6AEwAA#v=onepage&q=Montague%20John%20Druitt%3A%20Still%20Our%20Best%20Suspect%20by%20Andrew%20J.%20Spallek&f=false

I wasn't aware of this until recently myself, although I do have the original published issue of Ripper Notes which that article is in, as I was a subscriber at the time.

I do agree with you both about posting research online, it would be a great benefit to everybody, but unfortunately it doesn't always work out the way that you would hope. For instance:

A long, long time ago, I researched, obtained articles, transcribed them and then co-write "Jack the Ripper and the Tasmanian Press", my very first article for Ripperologist which was published in Dec. 2005. Some considerable amount of time later, I decided to do just what you are suggesting here, and donate all of the articles that appeared in Ripperologist, as well as some others that "didn't make the cut" to Casebook to add to the Press Reports section (especially since it's quite scant on Australian news reports anyway).
The offer was accepted and so I sent along everything that I had - 3 or 4 years later, those news articles have never been added to the Casebook collection.

So when things like that happen it just makes you question the worth of making such donations.

As for the document - surely there's not much chance that there's multiple documents called "The East End Murderer - I Knew Him" ? Bearing in mind that Farson was doing his research in the 1950's, memories would become very,very faded and distorted by that time, as demonstrated by other statements Farson collected.....the whole premise that an actual relative of Druitt would have written something to that effect and left it behind just sounds a little beyond the realms of belief in itself as well.

Cheers,
Adam.

[Jonathan H]

Unless it is Farson who was mistaken; was over-reaching himself?

I mean just consider what the source was supposed to be saying.

Me, and my family -- strangers in a strange land -- are related to Jack the Ripper, and we want the world to know it?

[Chris]

As for the document - surely there's not much chance that there's multiple documents called "The East End Murderer - I Knew Him" ? Bearing in mind that Farson was doing his research in the 1950's, memories would become very,very faded and distorted by that time, as demonstrated by other statements Farson collected.....the whole premise that an actual relative of Druitt would have written something to that effect and left it behind just sounds a little beyond the realms of belief in itself as well.

But it wouldn't be a question of "multiple documents called "The East End Murderer - I Knew Him"", because the St Arnaud Mercury article didn't bear that title. It was just a run-of-the-mill Ripper story, of which there were so many around that time.

I challenge anyone to come up with a plausible explanation of how a random Ripper story appearing in an Australian newspaper in a town where Lionel Druitt just happened to be living, could cause anyone years later to write Farson a letter saying that a Lionel Druitt, Drewett, or Drewery had written a document entitled "The East End Murderer - I knew him", which was printed in a completely different town - bearing in mind that M. J. Druitt's name was not at that time in the public domain as a Ripper suspect. As an explanation, it makes no sense.

A more likely explanation may be that Farson was simply confused about what the letter had said. The letter had been stolen along with a dossier of his Ripper material. He had made a separate note of it, but unfortunately it's not clear from his book exactly how much that note said. If he was supplying part of it from memory, that memory could obviously have been coloured by his subsequent findings.

But I've never really been satisfied by that explanation. One remarkable coincidence it would leave unexplained is that the document was supposed to have been printed at Dandenong, and Lionel Druitt did later live near there - something Farson could not have known until he started researching the Australian connection in earnest.

[Jonathan H]

Yes, but if you 'turn the telescope around' you discover that the whole story hinges on one source, Farson, who was manically biased against Tom Cullen for ripping off his stuff and publishing Druitt's name ahead of him -- because being a Yank, and a Commie, and a real journalist, he didn't give a stuff about the sensibilities of Lady Aberconway.

There is nothing to it.

Farson essentially made it up and then added details to it, as he found them, or should I say backdated them to make the tale have legs.