Assessing the case against W.H.Bury

[dixon9]

sorry this really my be a stupid question,but did (WHB) lodge in the east end when married to Ellen?

Again apologises if it has been answered

[Sam Flynn]

Thanks for the lesson in London's political geography! To whom shall I write the cheque?

Make it out to "The Society of People Who've Actually Lived There".

That's Bromley by Bow...

That's Gunthorpe Street …

That's Durward Street …

That's Henriques Street …

That's Duval Street … actually … That's whatever-the-hell the name of that service road is …

... as opposed to the London Borough of Bromley, which is south of the Thames by a considerable distance.

Thanks for the lesson in London's political geography! To whom shall I write the cheque?

Bow, as shorthand, is arguably a lesser evil than using "just" Bromley.

That, which is totally incorrect (e.g. "Bow", in this instance) is indeed "evil".

Whereas that, which is correct (e.g. "Bromley", in this instance) is anything but "evil".

[Sam Flynn]

Bromley!

Bury lived in Bromley!

That's Bromley by Bow... as opposed to the London Borough of Bromley, which is south of the Thames by a considerable distance. Bow, as shorthand, is arguably a lesser evil than using "just" Bromley.

[dixon9]

thanks for the reply blue

so his lodgings at 3 swaton road,11 blackthorn st and 3 spanby road were not bow in the east end?

Thanks again for putting me right

[thegaff]

hi all ive started on various suspects and tried to build on them but they all go to the wall but with bury everything keeps building more and more and more infact the more i read new things like on here ive learnt more details the people who doubt try to write him off by thinking too literally with there thinking you therefore discredit him but your eyes are blinded by facts one doubt is he stabbed her but didnt rip her 4 inches is a rip ans all ripper victims had stabs also he also went back to the body and played about with her insides no one mentions that , jtr was interested in the insides ellen bury was his wife they came home drunk someone doubts that a man like jtr cant be drunk and be jtr yes you can the adrenaline can override the alcohocol and he did drink heavily so he was used to it thats all i say for now mrs perfect id like to chat with you on him and swap info on him please yours martin

Martin, is this a stream of consciousness? Your ability to drop full stops and punctuation is almost an art.

Bury is simply the most convincing suspect we have. The evidence against him is not just circumstantial but also matches Bury in terms of timing and profiling. If only we had a photograph of him we could probably add witness evidence to the list.

... his lodgings in Bow ...

Most written accounts of Bury's tenure in London's 'East End' suggest that he resided in 'Bow'. These accounts are incorrect: All of Bury's known London residences, during the period in question, were in the Parish of Bromley St. Leonard, not the Parish of St. Mary Stratford Bow.

Bromley!

Bury lived in Bromley!

[dixon9]

obviously William Bury looks to be high on the list of suspects,a couple of things that are nagging me,his lodgings in Bow are (in walking terms) a fair old trot from the murder scenes.Would he have not be spotted (if blood was on him) travelling that far?Also only living in london about five months how well would he have known the routes home?
I have read Ellen saying he did stay out for days at a time,so that could be the answer but surely someone would have noticed his apperance etc?

Oh well please be gentle with me,but thats my reasoning behind (at the moment)why i cant have WHB as a major suspect,until one of you put me right.

[lovejoy]

mrs perfect pretty perfect

hi all ive started on various suspects and tried to build on them but they all go to the wall but with bury everything keeps building more and more and more infact the more i read new things like on here ive learnt more details the people who doubt try to write him off by thinking too literally with there thinking you therefore discredit him but your eyes are blinded by facts one doubt is he stabbed her but didnt rip her 4 inches is a rip ans all ripper victims had stabs also he also went back to the body and played about with her insides no one mentions that , jtr was interested in the insides ellen bury was his wife they came home drunk someone doubts that a man like jtr cant be drunk and be jtr yes you can the adrenaline can override the alcohocol and he did drink heavily so he was used to it thats all i say for now mrs perfect id like to chat with you on him and swap info on him please yours martin

[swagman]

picture of Bury ?

Hi Suzi. Just going back for a moment to the newpaper and pictures you posted earlier in the thread. Is 'our' Bury the man in the 2nd picture or have i misunderstood your purpose for the post ?

Paul

[Roy Corduroy]

By the way some author called Vanessa Hayes seems to be convinced that Dr Barnardo was the ripper - Ive been reading snippets of her book online. I note there is no section on Casebook for this 'suspect' - I'd have interested to know what you all think!

Hi, Sara, there was a huge discussion of Barnado this summer. Best I recall it ended happily with two Caseboook Forum members getting married!

Go to Page 12 of the General Discussion threads and Barnado is there.

Roy

[Sara]

All my ideas about JtR come form the details of the murders - the canonicals, as reported in the detailed press cuttings etc on this site. I have read none of the books associated with the case yet, and I have an open mind on the killer's identity.

Bury's clearly premeditated murder of his wife seems to me entirely different to the random murder of strangers with extreme violence, mainly in a public place from which immediate escape can be effected, which characterise the Ripper murders.

By the way some author called Vanessa Hayes seems to be convinced that Dr Barnardo was the ripper - Ive been reading snippets of her book online. I note there is no section on Casebook for this 'suspect' - I'd have interested to know what you all think!

And didn't Frank Smyth write a book on the Ripper back in the early 70s? I knew him quite well before his untimely death, and I'd have been interested to know what you all think of what he wrote, but there is no section on him in 'Authors'. I can't remember if he had a pet 'theory', maybe he just wrote an overview (which would be out of date by now)

{Apologies I don't know where to put these general remarks, please move if appropriate}

[Boggles]

was bury a copy cat murderer? ive pondered on this for some time and decided in the end that he probably wasnt. He wouldnt have used a rope, he would have slit the throat. Ive studied the mutilations and have no doubt it was a sexually motivated, there are thankfully very few people who had these kind of perverted urges - the chances of 2 such people in the same part of town at the same time - highly improbable (keppel did some work on this when investigating Tabram)

The only reason he remains such an obscure suspect is becuase he dosent fit many people preconcieved notions of what jack the ripper was or did. (like your own) Jtr didnt really take much pains to dispose of bodies he had some low cunning i grant you but he wasnt organised killer. From what we know about serial murderers now Bury fits the profile of jack quite well.
Anatomy of a myth was the first suspect orientated book written that had elements of critical thinking, it was an excellent piece of work and i cant wait for the next one from beadle.

[Sara]

Although there are some circumstantial reasons to put Bury on the suspect list, after reading all this I'd say he is a copycat murderer. I think the JtR murders had been playing on his mind and giving him ideas about how to get his hands on the rest of his wife's money - although it seems they had spent most of it already

Something about the man's psychology seems quite different from that of Jack's to me. I've never imagined JtR as an habitual drunkard. And I can't imagine Bury having the anatomical knowledge to eviscerate women in the manner that JtR apparently did - skillfully.

Most of all I can't imagine JtR making such an elaborate but essentially unintelligent plan as the fake job in Dundee, the box, the rope - all of which would lead straight to him - and most of all getting himself stuck with a corpse in a box which he couldn't lift up the stairs or otherwise dispose of! Whatever Jack was or wasn't, it would be hard to think of him as plain stupid.

The saddest question about the Bury story is what on earth Ellen saw in him, and why on earth she tolerated his violence. Her end seems quite inevitable somehow; yet several witnesses described them as 'affectionate' and 'friendly'. He must have been quite a charmer

[Mrsperfect]

Bury Finally 'Unmasked' eh?

Unless Bill Beadle's discovered a lot of new evidence, I can't see that he'd have much more to say in his new book. Perhaps he's correcting the few mistakes he made in the original version?

If that's the case, then the blurb about Bury being a horse butcher is still there, so I hope he's got some proof about that this time round!

I'd have to agree Sam, the first one was a good read!

Regards

Eileen