Bury - the cellar

[johns]

William Henry Bury married Ellen Elliott on 2nd April 1888 at the Parish Church, Bromley St Leonards.
William states his father also a William Henry Bury was alive and a fishmonger?
Didnt it say that he had a tragic childhood and that his father had a terrible accident and was ripped open? I suppose he could have lied though.....
Williams profession was given as a Sawdust Contractor.

Pat

Hi Paddy

Bury's father died horribly in a horse and cart accident when Bury was a wee boy as far as we know. He was a fishmonger though.

Where did you find Bury saying his father was alive?

Regards
John

[Cogidubnus]

No, I tried but it didn't let me access that...but perhaps I was doing something wrong...if I was, by all means PM or email me with enlightenment... (and spare my blushes )

Cheers!

Dave

[Paddy]

Mary Berrys medical notes

Yes poor lady.
She had had melancholia for 11 months.
On top of that her husband was killed.
Sounds like she didnt eat and just faded away.
Did you manage to get to the other page in volume 2, mentioned Dave?

Pat

[Cogidubnus]

As you say, very sad - Previously undiagnosed Postpartum Depression (at least in part) do you think Pat?

All the best

Dave

[Cogidubnus]

Blimey Pat,

When you're on a roll, then you're really on a roll...that's amazing...I'm going to have a look right now!

Every good wish

Dave

[Paddy]

Mary Berrys medical notes

I just found Mary Berrys notes from Powick Asylum Worcestershire.
(It is Williams mum even though name spelt different)

If you go to a website called George Marshall Medical Museum.
Chose Medical Archive (Top Right)
Do a basic search of all, writing in box the word Melancholia.
She will come up on page 8 as Mary Berry .
Its definitely the right one and it has her medical notes....very sad actually.
I found one of mine here a while back....

Pat.....................

[Cogidubnus]

Beadle says he found him in Wolverhampton in 1881 working as a Factor's Clerk.

In 1871 he'd still be at Stourbridge I assume as a Bluecoate School scholar - I don't know if he was tracked down there in the census though...

All the best

Dave

PS - he didn't make the 1891!

[Paddy]

Census

Thanks Guys,

Question.....
Has he ever been found on a census?

Pat

[Cogidubnus]

The Lancashire trial date (1882) looks to fall in that period between leaving Bissells (in Wolverhampton) under a cloud, and then reappearing at Mr Osbourne's in Lord Street...Beadle is vague on dates, but mentions that he "skedaddled" - did he skedaddle perchance to Lancashire, then make his way back to Wolverhampton when things got too hot for him there?

All the best

Dave

PS Another interesting post from Pat...you're really on form today!

[Paddy]

Marriage of William and Ellen Elliott

William Henry Bury married Ellen Elliott on 2nd April 1888 at the Parish Church, Bromley St Leonards.
William states his father also a William Henry Bury was alive and a fishmonger?
Didnt it say that he had a tragic childhood and that his father had a terrible accident and was ripped open? I suppose he could have lied though.....
Williams profession was given as a Sawdust Contractor.

Pat

[DVV]

I have to second Dave. Well done and thanks for posting it.

[Cogidubnus]

Wow - very nice find indeed Pat...It's certainly nothing I've heard about in Bury's life, and I'm pretty sure Beadle doesn't mention it...

Be great if someone more knowlegeable can confirm or deny!

Thanks for posting it

All the best

Dave

[Paddy]

Past Form?

Does anybody know if this could be the same chap in 1882 Lancashire?
Looks like there was a gang of them and only the top chap was convicted.

Pat

[Cogidubnus]

Possibly just a scarey dare to a friend? Why any schoolboy graffito anywhere?

Why would Bury write it? Why would his Missus, who on the one hand is argued illiterate, and then next moment isn't.. (Perhaps the left hand is illiterate and the other isn't... )

In fact why half the graffiti on the doors of pub or public toilets? It doesn't all, or even largely seem to be either contact info, or even have any purpose at all - When you think about it most graffiti anywhere is pretty pointless and puerile...

All the best

Dave

[Wyatt Earp]

As a sort of post script to this thread, I've now got hold of a copy of the second Beadle book, Jack the Ripper Unmasked.

Whilst in many way it's a great work, like Macpherson it lacks an index, and much of the work is unreferenced...there are a total of 41 references quoted but in a book of this nature, comprising over 300 pages, this doesn't seem particularly adequate...

The Page 247 quoted earlier in the thread refers to a report that Lamb and his colleagues checked out the cellar door on the same night the body was discovered, and at that time found the chalked messages. Unfortunately this report is unattributed and we don't know where it comes from, nor how reliable it might be...we don't even know, from Beadle at least, exactly how much police activity there was, and how much attention it might've attracted from the local populace...nor whether the place was cordoned off (I rather suspect from the newspaper reports, it wasn't).

So I'm afraid in terms of clarifying the original questions raised in this thread, the Beadle book hasn't really helped much at all!

All the best

Dave

Dave, I think a significant problem for any theory that the messages were written after Ellen's murder is the content of the messages themselves. Why would a schoolboy write "Jack Ripper is at the back of this door" after Ellen's murder when the assumption is that word had gotten around within the community that Bury was in police custody and no longer at the residence?