Suspect Witnesses?

[The Rookie Detective]

I'm a little confused - did Schwartz not understand what he saw, because interpreting what he saw required a good command of English, or did he just witness "a little street hassle", that could be understood by any witness of any background?

Did the witness(es) to the following report understand what they seeing?

The police have been told that a man, aged between 35 and 40 years of age, and of fair complexion, was seen to throw the woman murdered in Berner-street to the ground. Those who saw it thought that it was a man and his wife quarrelling, and no notice was taken of it.

Could it be that those who saw it thought it was a man and wife quarrelling, because it was a husband and wife quarrelling? If yes, who was the man, and who was the wife?

Schwartz and his wife.


THAT'S why Schwartz went to the police.

He was essentially BS man and he knew he had been witnesed to throw his wife down onto the ground.

So he goes to the police and essentially invents BS man the drunken gentile, to try and cover that it was HE that threw his wife down on the floor.

And if that's the case, then maybe Stride and her killer were also witnesses to that assault.

Could there be a scenario whereby Stride goes over to the yard to check on the wife?

Thet is thevl catalyst for Stride going into the yard; to help Schwartz's wife who has just been assaulted by her husband.

Of course, perhaps Stride got involved and was then murdered?

Schwartz (who is BS man) runs off and the wife goes back into the club.

Or the wife could be "Yaffa"

I reckon Schwarz and his wife were both club members

Lots to hypothesise here, haha!

[New Waterloo]

Valid points c.d.

Just trying to sort of put myself into the mindset of these people and walking through it in my head.

BS man looked as if he had been drinking and yes he could have an unusual way of walking but there is a good chance at that time of night that he may have had a drink. I think if BS man was associated with the club he would have spoken with Stride for longer but seems to resort to grabbing her very quickly after arriving at the gate. Also I am inclined to think that if a member of the club he would have subconsciously positioned himself between Stride and the open yard and after shouting or speaking with her pushed her away. Sort of defensively positioning himself to prevent her entering. Saying something like clear off. That doesn't appear to be what Schwartz suggests.

The witness says words to the effect of her being pulled into the street so yes I agree more with your first point that he wanted to take her somewhere which if he was a drunken man looking for a quick bit of action probably meant anywhere a bit more out of the way. Certainly not a club yard with singing and people coming and going. That was my thinking on whether he managed to pursued Stride to go as far as the corner of Fairclough with him (seen by Brown) and then she manages to give him the slip. Saying loud enough for Brown to hear 'Not Tonight'. (or similar)

Or if it was her man Kidney dragged off to some doss house somewhere I guess.

Music and singing and a chance of some happiness draws her back to the club.

NW

[c.d.]

He was essentially BS man and he knew he had been witnesed to throw his wife down onto the ground.

So he goes to the police and essentially invents BS man the drunken gentile, to try and cover that it was HE that threw his wife down on the floor.

And would the police or actually anybody else give a rat's behind because a husband threw his wife to the ground? Hardly a hanging offense.

c.d.

[c.d.]

I can see the headlines now -- Wife Thrown to the Ground by Husband!!: Police Appalled, Vow Crackdown on Misogyny in Whitechapel!!

c.d.

[The Rookie Detective]

He was essentially BS man and he knew he had been witnesed to throw his wife down onto the ground.

So he goes to the police and essentially invents BS man the drunken gentile, to try and cover that it was HE that threw his wife down on the floor.

And would the police or actually anybody else give a rat's behind because a husband threw his wife to the ground? Hardly a hanging offense.

c.d.

Yes, but if that assault happened to occur in the same location that a woman was later murdered, then yes.

So what im suggesting is that there WAS an assault, but that assault was Schwartz on his wife, who were both club members.

Schwartz was BS man.

Stride then goes over to the yard to assist, but is subsequently murdered by persons unknown.

So Stride isn't the woman assaulted.

She just interferes with a domestic that takes place between Schwartz and his wife just outside the club.

So Schwartz is compelled to go to the police and make up a story about another man he sees attack Stride.

And because Schwartz and his wife (who was the real woman assaulted outside the club) are club members, Schwartz's wife is told to keep quiet.

And the reason why Schwartz looks theatrical, is because he deliberately enhances his stereotypical Jewish look so that he isn't recognised as the man who was the man seen assaulting his own wife.

And the reason Abberline believes him, is because Schwartz isn't lying about an assault having taken place, but rather WHO was assaulted and WHO the assailant was.

The fact that Stride is then murdered after she goes into the yard to help the wife, could be the real reason why she ended up in the yard in the first place.

Wrong place, wrong time


Just a thought

[c.d.]

Just a thought

And a damn fine one at that. All that is lacking is evidence.

c.d.