Suspect Witnesses?

[GBinOz]

I think Stride was probably lured into the passageway with the promise of something. She took some convincing. Perhaps Overcoat Man was a gentile, but with some association with someone(s) at the club. Hence the protective stories about a man pursued and the witnessing of an assault at the gateway by a man who shouts 'Lipski'. What did OM believe the Juwes would be blamed for?

Hi Andrew,

So who was present to make this promise. It is unlikely that it was her antagonist, BSMan. It could have been Pipeman acting in the White Knight role after warning off BSMan. IMO the critical question is...where is Parcelman.

Cheers, George

[NotBlamedForNothing]

Hi Andrew,

So who was present to make this promise. It is unlikely that it was her antagonist, BSMan. It could have been Pipeman acting in the White Knight role after warning off BSMan. IMO the critical question is...where is Parcelman.

Cheers, George

Hi George.

Not necessarily anyone if he is a sneaker f***k*r, and not necessarily anything tangible. Perhaps it's the promise of getting her a gig (broadly defined) at the club. I think the statement "Not tonight, some other night" is interesting - she isn't accepting his offer, nor is she indicating he should give up trying. He's tempting her with something.

I don't know if this is Parcelman, or that person has gone off. That latter might indicate that Stride was happy to chat to 'randoms' on the street.

[Darryl Kenyon]

Three women had been brutally murdered in the previous few weeks within not more than a few hundred yards away to the gates of the club and the killer is still at large. A man comes along who manhandles Liz outside said gates and then persuades her to go into a darkened yard with him. Where upon she herself is violently killed with no defence wounds and in fact it seems the opposite, that Liz was in a relaxed state [ cachous in hand ]. The first physician on the scene - Blackwell says I formed the opinion that the murderer probably caught hold of the silk scarf, which was tight and knotted, and pulled the deceased backwards, cutting her throat in that way. So in other words Liz had her back turned to her assailant . An assailant who has just thrown her to the ground, and thrown out a racial slur where upon one man [ at least ] was scared enough to scurry down the street. Yet Liz turns her back on this person and walks into a yard which is pretty much devoid of light. Not for me

Regards Darryl

[The Rookie Detective]

If Parcelman was holding a folded coat in a parcel, then he could have been any of the other individuals mentioned being there that night.

Unlikely, but what if he was holding an overcoat folded into a parcel?

[NotBlamedForNothing]

Not necessarily anyone if he is a sneaker f***k*r, and not necessarily anything tangible.

Sneaker f**k*r or sneaky f**k*r? Perhaps he was sneaky f**k*r who wore sneakers? Perhaps he and Stride sneaked into the yard together, unheard by the women in the kitchen. Sneaked or snuck? Perhaps they sneaked in and he snuck out.

[New Waterloo]

Regarding the witness Schwartz, (the Hungarian). I so no reason to doubt that he existed and reported what he saw to the police. Again there may be problems with his interpretation of what he saw and this could be the same for many witnesses.

Reading through The Star articles again it is interesting to note that Schwartz describes the location of the pushing and pulling incident as the 'alleyway' where the body of Stride was later found. He then uses the word 'passage'.

When interpreters are used there are some obvious difficulties with finding the right translations for things. However the interpreter would have conversed with Schwartz to clarify.

If Schwartz was familiar with the Socialist Club he would have said that that was the location. To say an alleyway would seem to suggest that that is what he thought it was.

I think this suggests if nothing else that he was unfamiliar with the club, OR as suggested by others that he has described another location close by. Isn't there an alley way just before the club on the same side of the road.

I just don't know why he didn't say in the gateway to the club. Maybe I have missed something in reports about what Schwartz said but as it stands he mentions Berner Street and an alleyway. Maybe he witnessed another 'domestic' and later put two and two together and got five.

I have written this but it seems unlikely but worth saying I think

NW

[c.d.]

When interpreters are used there are some obvious difficulties with finding the right translations for things. However the interpreter would have conversed with Schwartz to clarify.

I don't think we can say that with any degree of confidence, N.W. Maybe the interpreter felt he completely understood what was being said by Schwartz.

Plus, Schwartz was a foreigner so we have no way of knowing what all those terms actually meant to him.

And don't we still argue about them today?

c.d

[Wickerman]

Except for that mythical character who conveniently found her standing alone in the gateway.

Stride had not been seen alone at anytime that night, so why do you think she was alone in the gateway?

I think Stride was probably lured into the passageway with the promise of something. She took some convincing. Perhaps Overcoat Man was a gentile, but with some association with someone(s) at the club. Hence the protective stories about a man pursued and the witnessing of an assault at the gateway by a man who shouts 'Lipski'. What did OM believe the Juwes would be blamed for?

She doesn't need to be lured into the yard, she's with a man. Either a client or a date, either way, stepping into the shadows for a quick smooch or something more intimate is only to be expected with many couples.
What is not likely is to say she walked into the yard by herself.

I can't see this line of reasoning going anywhere.

[Wickerman]

Hi Jon,

Could this have been the case, a brief interlude while Spooner was accompanying his girlfriend home, after which he returns to the corner to see the Jews running back and forth. Harris emerges to enquire what happened, but stays put to later advise as P.C. a to the direction of the disturbance, as observed by Brown.

Cheer, George

Spooner said he was with his girl standing outside the Beehive pub, "when two Jews came running along . ."

Are you suggesting he wasn't with his girl at that location?

[Wickerman]

If Parcelman was holding a folded coat in a parcel, then he could have been any of the other individuals mentioned being there that night.

Unlikely, but what if he was holding an overcoat folded into a parcel?

How many men do you think Stride was with, who carried a parcel, at the same time, at the same location?