Miller's Court - The Fire

[Geddy2112]

I've always had 'issues' with how well Jackie Boy (or girl) was able to perform his deeds in such darkened conditions with such speed. Of course we are led to believe he really went to town in Miller's Court and I presume the 'illumination' from the fire helped.

My question is how bright would the fire have been? Would it still have been enough (with a candle perhaps) to see well enough? (The photos tell us it was.)

Just I struggle getting up in the night to go to the loo without kicking the cat etc... how did JtR manage in such gloomy conditions?

[Errata]

I've always had 'issues' with how well Jackie Boy (or girl) was able to perform his deeds in such darkened conditions with such speed. Of course we are led to believe he really went to town in Miller's Court and I presume the 'illumination' from the fire helped.

My question is how bright would the fire have been? Would it still have been enough (with a candle perhaps) to see well enough? (The photos tell us it was.)

Just I struggle getting up in the night to go to the loo without kicking the cat etc... how did JtR manage in such gloomy conditions?

The fire was probably bright enough, but what just occurred to me is that he would be unlikely to position himself so that he was between the fire and the body. He would block most of the available light. Which means he was likely up near her head and shoulders, not at her side or between her legs.

[John G]

I would ask why he needed a fire at all. Eddowes, for example, was killed and mutilated in what might have been the darkest part of Mitre Square, and yet, according to the Victorian doctors, significantly more skill was demonstrated than in the case of Kelly, who was virtually butchered.

[Joshua Rogan]

Agreed, the fire could definitely cast enough light, but not necessarily in the right direction. The highest flames would be roughly the same height as the bed, so I suspect he would have needed the candle as well, to fill in areas of shadow.

Either that, or he ate a lot of carrots.

Also, depending on the fuel being burned, he may well have had to keep breaking off from his 'work' to throw another item on the fire. Newspaper burns brightly enough, but not for very long, so it would take an awful lot of fish and chip wrappers, unless he was a very fast worker.

[Joshua Rogan]

John, you forgot the rest of Doctor Sequeira's observation;

"Where the murder was committed was probably the darkest part of the square, but there was sufficient light to enable the miscreant to perpetrate the deed."

[John G]

John, you forgot the rest of Doctor Sequeira's observation;

"Where the murder was committed was probably the darkest part of the square, but there was sufficient light to enable the miscreant to perpetrate the deed."

Hi Joshua,

Yes, Dr Sequeira was, of course stating the obvious, as the deed, was indeed, perpetrated in the Square-unless it's to be argued that the murder took place elsewhere and the body dumped.

However, the point is Kelly was probably killed later in the morning than Eddowes-possibly much later-when it was presumably significantly, or even substantially, lighter. So, considering much less skill appears to have been exhibited at the Kelly murder scene, why would the perpetrator, assuming he was JtR, have required the assistance of artificial light?

[Pcdunn]

John, you forgot the rest of Doctor Sequeira's observation;

"Where the murder was committed was probably the darkest part of the square, but there was sufficient light to enable the miscreant to perpetrate the deed."

Right, so how much is "sufficient"? Where did the light come from? The stars?

And, "miscreant"--really? Sounds like a light word for what Jack did to Kate.

[Joshua Rogan]

Mmmm, it's hard to tell from his words if the doc was just stating the obvious, or whether he was making a judgement on the lighting level in that corner. However, since he was said to be familiar with the court, I'd plump for the latter. Although maybe he ate lots of carrots too.

[Joshua Rogan]

Right, so how much is "sufficient"? Where did the light come from? The stars?

And, "miscreant"--really? Sounds like a light word for what Jack did to Kate.

I believe there were two gas lamps inside the square which would have thrown at least some light into the corner, and one in the Mitre St entrance (which wouldn't).

You're right, though, he should have found a stronger term than "miscreant" for the naughty rascal.

[Errata]

I believe there were two gas lamps inside the square which would have thrown at least some light into the corner, and one in the Mitre St entrance (which wouldn't).

You're right, though, he should have found a stronger term than "miscreant" for the naughty rascal.

miscreant is actually a pretty strong word. It just doesn't carry much weight anymore because it just sort of sounds bland. It's been overthrown onomatapoetically by tougher sounding words like "animal" and "monster". But in truth "miscreant" means depraved and vile. So fair usage, it just sounds mild to our ears.

[Rosella]

Well, at least he didn't say 'rascal' which has completely lost its original meaning!

The fire in Miller's Court would have given some light, even if it was merely flickering shadows on the walls. However, Jack's main object may have been to give himself some warmth which he would surely need in an icy room.

Perhaps he brought his own source of light with him in the form of a couple of candles in receptacles. There were several ginger beer bottles in the room that could have been used as holders. If candle grease adhered to any of them the police would have taken it as Mary having used them as candle holders in the past.

[Michael W Richards]

John, you forgot the rest of Doctor Sequeira's observation;

"Where the murder was committed was probably the darkest part of the square, but there was sufficient light to enable the miscreant to perpetrate the deed."

Only an applicable reference if the same person killed both women.

[c.d.]

I think it reasonable to assume that Mary's killer would have made an inquiry as to the likelihood of them being disturbed. It is possible that Mary's response was my neighbors know I have company when I have a fire going and they won't bother us.

If Mary was under the impression that this could be a regular customer who had some money the fire could have been a way to make him feel more comfortable.

c.d.

[Paddy]

Could he have had medical knowlege and thought that heat might speed up the process of Rigor Mortis therefor confusing the time of death?

Pat...

[richardnunweek]

Hi.
If one takes the words.''Alright my love , you will be comfortable.'' Heard by Hutchinson, surely that could suggest that Mary may well have lit the fire after returning to her room, to warm the place up.
Seems logical.
If so Hutchinson would have been telling the truth. and all we have to determine is ''Did her client kill her''? or did she die after he left.
Regards Richard.