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  • Room No 13 in VR - THREAD

    I'll start a NEW thread here which I hope to use is evaluate and discuss my VR scene of Number 13 Miller's Court. I Want to try to keep this thread on subject to include the accuracy and development of the VR of this room. So no going off at a tangent to discuss and argue the actual intricacies of the case etc.

    I need the experts on these forums to help guide me toward the most accurate depiction of what room 13 looked like, what it contained, the position and location of items in the room, the makeup of the room such as the wainscotting, partition door, fire surround... everything.

    Here is a new video of the room.
    https://youtu.be/_LCTWxFL0J0

    Things to mention:
    The room is 10 x 12 in VR with the chimney breast being about 18 inches deep into the room.
    The content of the room is not interactable (you can't pick things up or bump into them) because, firstly, the room is too small and there would be hardly any space to stand and move about - sort of like in real life you'd only have a couple of people in the room and there would be no space to really move about much, and secondly, I consider this to be a 'viewing' experience and not a game. It's an experience where you can look, consider and discuss the case with respect and consideration for the victims. It helps that you can walk through the furnishings because it means you can position yourself in any place and view it from any angle (eg stand/crouch in the 'MJK3' camera position).

    In the Video you will note:
    I've put a washstand behind the headboard of the bed with the bed moved toward the fireplace. Because I think that if there WAS a washstand (debatable) then this is a logical place for it to could go. The bed was in this position because I think that during a cold November Autumn, it would be logical for the occupant to get the bed as close to the fire and away from that cold far corner. Moreover, there is space for the small (bedside) table to be moved during the day so that it doesn't obstruct the opening of the door. The table can then be bought to the side of the bed when the occupant is at home and getting ready to sleep.

    The room contains:
    Bed, mattress & pillow
    Large table
    Small table
    tin bath
    washstand with bowl
    Pitcher/tin water jug
    A cupboard to the right of the fire surround
    A bucket
    A kettle
    A pot
    Two ginger beer bottles
    Two plates
    tin cup
    A piece of pottery
    A piece of bread
    A picture hanging on the chimney breast (Fisherman's Widow)
    A chair
    A bullseye lantern (to light the darkened room)
    A candle in a broken bottle on the small table
    Curtains on the big window
    A nailed on curtain on the small window covering the broken pane. (I know it was an old coat in reality!)


    For those with VR this will be online soon and if you happen to be using your VR in a large room (bigger than the VR room of No13) then you can actually walk around No13 without having to use any controllers to move - literally, you can walk around No13 like you're in the room. It's quite surreal!

    For the rest of us, you can use your desktop PC to access the room once it's online.

    I still feel there is a way to go before it's ready.

    the link to the latest video again:
    https://youtu.be/_LCTWxFL0J0


    Please use this thread to discuss improvements, inaccuracies, changes, omissions, inclusions, aesthetics, suggestions yadda yadda...

    Thanks






    Last edited by richardh; 11-16-2020, 02:20 PM.
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  • #2
    Wow Richard, this is an amazing piece of work.

    I am certainly not an "expert", so I will leave it to others to confirm/correct the issues you raise.

    I have never been able to accurately "picture" 13 Miller's Court in regard to just how small it actually was, your reconstruction has clarified this.

    One thing that strikes me is the fact that in your reconstruction, the bed is clearly a single bed, not a double.

    Comment


    • #3
      Always amazed with your work Richard.

      well done
      "When the legend becomes fact... print the legend"
      - The Man Who Shot Liberty Valance (1962)

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by barnflatwyngarde View Post
        Wow Richard, this is an amazing piece of work.

        I am certainly not an "expert", so I will leave it to others to confirm/correct the issues you raise.

        I have never been able to accurately "picture" 13 Miller's Court in regard to just how small it actually was, your reconstruction has clarified this.

        One thing that strikes me is the fact that in your reconstruction, the bed is clearly a single bed, not a double.
        Thank you.

        Now, let the debate begin! Was the bed single, three quarter or double?
        Given the limited space in the room I think a double can be dismissed. But how about a three quarter? Personally, I think it was just a single and this seems to be so in MJK2.


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        ---------------------------------------------------
        HHAP

        Comment


        • #5
          This is amazing work, Richard!

          It really hammers home just how desolate Millers Court was, and you can almost smell the damp wood and old smoke from the fire.

          I wouldn't claim to be an expert by any stretch of the imagination, but was about to mention that I thought there was a coat covering one of the windows, when I realised you had already advised in your list above that you had plumped for an old nailed up curtain instead.



          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by richardh View Post

            Thank you.

            Now, let the debate begin! Was the bed single, three quarter or double?
            Given the limited space in the room I think a double can be dismissed. But how about a three quarter? Personally, I think it was just a single and in the picthis seems to be so in MJK2.

            Yep! I've always seen it as either a single bed or a three quarter in the pics.

            I'm sure McCarthy would have furnished his lets with the bare minimum, so a single would make sense to me.

            Comment


            • #7
              Richard...


              absolutely phenomenal work and really takes things to a whole new level in terms of enhancing the feeling of being there; taken back like a window through time.

              I watched the video with a mixture of awe, apprehension, curiosity and even sadness.

              truly humbling to bare witness to such an amazing piece of work.

              I’m no expert unfortunately, but doesn’t take an expert to appreciate your incredible efforts to take us all back.

              I could almost smell the dampness in the room, the coldness in the room and at one point could even have imagined Kelly walking into the room.


              Well done sir!

              TRD

              Comment


              • #8
                Wonderful work. Watching that was very moving.

                Poor Mary Jane, living in a room like that. So small, grubby and miserable.

                I feel that I now better appreciate how small and cramped the room really was.

                Thank you for putting in so much time and effort on a project like this.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Spectacular as always Richard, I still have copies of your earlier work which was stunning enough, but this is so over the top it's almost unnerving.

                  One observation, the chimney breast. Was it intentional to make it look like green marble, or is it just my eyesight?

                  Brilliant though, just brilliant.
                  Regards, Jon S.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by richardh View Post

                    Thank you.

                    Now, let the debate begin! Was the bed single, three quarter or double?
                    Given the limited space in the room I think a double can be dismissed. But how about a three quarter? Personally, I think it was just a single and this seems to be so in MJK2.

                    You had an earlier thread with these questions. I'm sure my wife told me the bed in the pic. was a three-quarter. I think thats what I wrote previously.
                    The Three-quarter was just bigger than the Single, but smaller than the Double.
                    Last edited by Wickerman; 11-16-2020, 10:21 PM.
                    Regards, Jon S.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by richardh View Post
                      I'll start a NEW thread here which I hope to use is evaluate and discuss my VR scene of Number 13 Miller's Court. I Want to try to keep this thread on subject to include the accuracy and development of the VR of this room. So no going off at a tangent to discuss and argue the actual intricacies of the case etc.

                      I need the experts on these forums to help guide me toward the most accurate depiction of what room 13 looked like, what it contained, the position and location of items in the room, the makeup of the room such as the wainscotting, partition door, fire surround... everything.

                      Here is a new video of the room.
                      https://youtu.be/_LCTWxFL0J0

                      Things to mention:
                      The room is 10 x 12 in VR with the chimney breast being about 18 inches deep into the room.
                      The content of the room is not interactable (you can't pick things up or bump into them) because, firstly, the room is too small and there would be hardly any space to stand and move about - sort of like in real life you'd only have a couple of people in the room and there would be no space to really move about much, and secondly, I consider this to be a 'viewing' experience and not a game. It's an experience where you can look, consider and discuss the case with respect and consideration for the victims. It helps that you can walk through the furnishings because it means you can position yourself in any place and view it from any angle (eg stand/crouch in the 'MJK3' camera position).

                      In the Video you will note:
                      I've put a washstand behind the headboard of the bed with the bed moved toward the fireplace. Because I think that if there WAS a washstand (debatable) then this is a logical place for it to could go. The bed was in this position because I think that during a cold November Autumn, it would be logical for the occupant to get the bed as close to the fire and away from that cold far corner. Moreover, there is space for the small (bedside) table to be moved during the day so that it doesn't obstruct the opening of the door. The table can then be bought to the side of the bed when the occupant is at home and getting ready to sleep.

                      The room contains:
                      Bed, mattress & pillow
                      Large table
                      Small table
                      tin bath
                      washstand with bowl
                      Pitcher/tin water jug
                      A cupboard to the right of the fire surround
                      A bucket
                      A kettle
                      A pot
                      Two ginger beer bottles
                      Two plates
                      tin cup
                      A piece of pottery
                      A piece of bread
                      A picture hanging on the chimney breast (Fisherman's Widow)
                      A chair
                      A bullseye lantern (to light the darkened room)
                      A candle in a broken bottle on the small table
                      Curtains on the big window
                      A nailed on curtain on the small window covering the broken pane. (I know it was an old coat in reality!)


                      For those with VR this will be online soon and if you happen to be using your VR in a large room (bigger than the VR room of No13) then you can actually walk around No13 without having to use any controllers to move - literally, you can walk around No13 like you're in the room. It's quite surreal!

                      For the rest of us, you can use your desktop PC to access the room once it's online.

                      I still feel there is a way to go before it's ready.

                      the link to the latest video again:
                      https://youtu.be/_LCTWxFL0J0


                      Please use this thread to discuss improvements, inaccuracies, changes, omissions, inclusions, aesthetics, suggestions yadda yadda...

                      Thanks





                      Fantastic work sir much respect

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Wickerman View Post
                        Spectacular as always Richard, I still have copies of your earlier work which was stunning enough, but this is so over the top it's almost unnerving.

                        One observation, the chimney breast. Was it intentional to make it look like green marble, or is it just my eyesight?

                        Brilliant though, just brilliant.
                        Thanks
                        Yes, the texturing on the chimney breast is a bit crap. I've changed it now for a cracked plaster texture to see if that looks better.
                        https://jtr3d.com/wp-content/uploads...asterwall2.png

                        https://jtr3d.com/wp-content/uploads...PlaterWall.png

                        https://jtr3d.com/wp-content/uploads...reenshot_5.png

                        I've opted for a standard single bed because I think that would be the most likely size for a room that size and the cheapest/most easily acquired bed that the landlord would cough up for!
                        Last edited by richardh; 11-18-2020, 12:26 PM.
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                        JtR3D.com JtR 3D Blog
                        ---------------------------------------------------
                        HHAP

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Some more screenshots:

                          https://jtr3d.com/wp-content/uploads...reenshot_6.png

                          https://jtr3d.com/wp-content/uploads...reenshot_7.png

                          https://jtr3d.com/wp-content/uploads...reenshot_8.png

                          https://jtr3d.com/wp-content/uploads...reenshot_9.png

                          https://jtr3d.com/wp-content/uploads...eenshot_10.png

                          https://jtr3d.com/wp-content/uploads...eenshot_11.png


                          And an MJK1 view!
                          https://jtr3d.com/wp-content/uploads...eenshot_12.png
                          Last edited by richardh; 11-18-2020, 12:45 PM.
                          ---------------------------------------------------
                          JtR3D.com JtR 3D Blog
                          ---------------------------------------------------
                          HHAP

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            There are a number of descriptions of the room in the press reports of the time which differ slightly in their detail. The Star, based on the visit of the inquest jury to the room said: It contained two very old tables, a broken chair, an ancient wooden bedstead, and a dilapidated fender. In a corner there was a pail, and these few articles exhausted the catalogue of the furniture. There are also at least two contemporary sketches, one of which is reproduced (but not credited) in Patricia Cornwell's book Ripper. These appear to show a washstand between the head of the bed and the wall in addition to the two other tables. It also shows a chair at the foot of the bed with MJK's clothes on it including what looks like a chemise hung over the back. The bed appears to be a three quarter sized one which were very popular in Victorian days.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              There are a lot of reproductions of the police photograph of the scene in Room 13 of varying degrees of clarity but several of them appear to show an object under the bed which can be seen between the legs of the table. In many of them it looks to me to have the shape of a chamber pot and some seem to show a floral design on it. Although it is not mentioned in the inventory in the inquest reports it would seem to be a very likely thing to have been found in the room of as fastidious a girl as MJK.

                              Comment

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