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  • Shelley House Stables

    Earlier, on another thread, I mentioned the Star News reporter (Claude Mellor) had disembarked from a steamship at a Chelsea Pier and headed up the embankment. It appears to me now, he had to be headed up Grosvenor Road (not along the banks of the Thames) and upon approaching the Shelley house he noticed a large wrapped parcel thrown in the underbrush near the railings of the garden. He fetched PC Jones, 182B and together they entered the yard, through the stables, and found the package contained the right thigh of a woman, wrapped in a blue and white checked "pocket". The thigh was later confirmed to belong to the body of Elizabeth Jackson.

    I have been uncertain whether or not the Shelley estate would even contain stables, so I was unclear if the thigh was actually on their property or on the east side gardens of the Victoria Hospital. Until now.

    I located a letter from James Whistler stating his displeasure of having the Shelley Stables as his neighbor. Whistler lived on Tite Street in the "White House" which would have boardered the Shelley Estate. Below are the extracts of that letter and one other and some pictures which may show the gate to the stables of the Shelley House?

    https://www.whistler.arts.gla.ac.uk/...lay/?cid=06163

    "It will in due course dawn upon the Board that Mr Böehm Mr Leighton or Mr Watts if works of art require thought and time! - and that the elbow of Mr Böehm, Mr Leighton or Mr Watts[6] may not be jogged - that no limit can therefor[e] be assigned to the completion of the bas reliefs with which they stipulated my house shall be enriched - weeks or months even must go by - during which (I doubt if under less than a year would be entertained) during which time I must wait in the street - unless after all the Board are content to stultify themselves and after insisting upon my covering with costly palatial ornament a simple house in a back street with Sir Percy Shellys[7] stables [p. 3] for a neighbor,

    Percy F. Shelley's home, Shelley House, in Chelsea Embankment, held a private theatre from 1881. JW's White House, designed by E. W. Godwin, and situated on Tite Street, was apparently next to his stables (#06163).







    Looking up the road in the first picture, you would run into Oscar Wildes home at #34 Tite Street and further up at #9 Tite street, about 1887, Sir Melville MacNaghten made his home upon returning from India.

  • #2
    Originally posted by jerryd View Post
    Earlier, on another thread, I mentioned the Star News reporter (Claude Mellor) had disembarked from a steamship at a Chelsea Pier and headed up the embankment. It appears to me now, he had to be headed up Grosvenor Road (not along the banks of the Thames)
    I'm a bit confused Jerry...you say Mellor diembarked at "a Chelsea Pier"...do you think that should just be "Chelsea Pier", which was just by Albert Bridge? There was Victoria pier, about the same distance the other way from the Shelley House, but the capitalisation leads me to suspect it was the former.
    ​​​​​
    Also, Grosvenor Road is further along the Thames, past Chelsea Bridge, but still runs along it's bank (or rather, the Embankment). West of Chelsea Bridge the same road along the Embankment seems to simply be called Chelsea Embankment, on period maps. Both piers mentioned are on that road, not Grosvenor.

    Anyway, aside from that, great work tracking down the letter and photos! I will post a map of where I think the stables were, when I get a chance, but I think you're spot on. Didn't Whistler have to sell his new house before he'd even moved in, due to a costly court case? (he won, but I think was awarded just £1 in damages).

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    • #3
      Originally posted by Joshua Rogan View Post

      I'm a bit confused Jerry...you say Mellor diembarked at "a Chelsea Pier"...do you think that should just be "Chelsea Pier", which was just by Albert Bridge? There was Victoria pier, about the same distance the other way from the Shelley House, but the capitalisation leads me to suspect it was the former.
      ​​​​​
      Also, Grosvenor Road is further along the Thames, past Chelsea Bridge, but still runs along it's bank (or rather, the Embankment). West of Chelsea Bridge the same road along the Embankment seems to simply be called Chelsea Embankment, on period maps. Both piers mentioned are on that road, not Grosvenor.

      Anyway, aside from that, great work tracking down the letter and photos! I will post a map of where I think the stables were, when I get a chance, but I think you're spot on. Didn't Whistler have to sell his new house before he'd even moved in, due to a costly court case? (he won, but I think was awarded just £1 in damages).
      Sorry for the confusion Joshua. Chelsea Embankment is what I meant. The capitalization is my fault too on Chelsea Pier. There was Cadogan Pier as well, btw. I am not quite sure which pier he disembarked from?

      John Singer Sargent was Whistler's neighbor. Tite Street seemed fairly "artsy". Marie Belloc Lowndes (The Lodger) frequented Wildes place.
      Last edited by jerryd; 03-26-2019, 08:34 PM.

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      • #4
        Below are several Google maps current views of the Shelley house and surrounding areas. This is not the original house of course but where it was located.


        Shelley House with cars in front. (zooming in shows the same "niche" that Debs found)


        View of niche and to right can be seen #1 Embankment Gardens. This area was built,IIRC, in the mid 1890's? I'm sure purely coincidental but living at #1 Embankment Gardens in the mid 1890's was Sir John Paget Mellor. I haven't found a relationship between the two men, yet.




        Green arrow is the White House of Whistler. The Shelley stables bordered his house. The left red arrow is the former location of the Shelley estate and right arrow is the former residence of Sir John Paget Mellor.
        Last edited by jerryd; 03-27-2019, 02:26 AM. Reason: Added Mellor info

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        • #5

          Another view looking east.


          Pin marks #56, Tite Street. Now called Shelley Court but once housed the Shelley Theatre. The former Shelley estate is bottom left in this picture.


          View of the entire area including Albert Bridge and Battersea Park.
          Last edited by jerryd; 03-27-2019, 02:11 AM.

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          • #6
            My green arrow for Whistlers house may be off by one. But hopefully you all get the drift?

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            • #7
              Originally posted by jerryd View Post

              Sorry for the confusion Joshua. Chelsea Embankment is what I meant. The capitalization is my fault too on Chelsea Pier. There was Cadogan Pier as well, btw. I am not quite sure which pier he disembarked from?

              John Singer Sargent was Whistler's neighbor. Tite Street seemed fairly "artsy". Marie Belloc Lowndes (The Lodger) frequented Wildes place.
              "Fairly" artsy? That would be the understatement of the year!! Sublime work, Jerry - I like how, for the forst time, I think, we can see that the killer would have been spoilt for choices when it comes to the many options he had when picking a place to throw away the leg.
              Last edited by Fisherman; 03-27-2019, 06:18 AM.

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              • #8
                Awesome work jerry.
                these views just exeplify that torsoman had the river at his disposal mere feet away the whole time from the bridge, yet waits a half mile to chuck it over a fence into someones yard.

                And from these views im now not so sure that the main part of the torso found in battersea park could have been thrown from the bridge.
                "Is all that we see or seem
                but a dream within a dream?"

                -Edgar Allan Poe


                "...the man and the peaked cap he is said to have worn
                quite tallies with the descriptions I got of him."

                -Frederick G. Abberline

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                • #9
                  Originally posted by jerryd View Post

                  Sorry for the confusion Joshua. Chelsea Embankment is what I meant. The capitalization is my fault too on Chelsea Pier. There was Cadogan Pier as well, btw. I am not quite sure which pier he disembarked from?
                  No worries. Cadogan Pier seems to be the modern name for Chelsea Pier. Just to add to the confusion there was also Carlyle Pier by Battersea Bridge, upstream from Albert Bridge.
                  ​​​​

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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by jerryd View Post
                    My green arrow for Whistlers house may be off by one. But hopefully you all get the drift?
                    It may be a bit off for Whistler's house, but I think that's exactly where the stables would have been (where no.37 now stands). By my reckoning, anyway.
                    Looking at the old maps, the Shelley house had a rear garden that narrowed from slightly wider than the back of the house to a narrow strip which led to buildings at the rear, and these had an entrance on Tite St. On the photo you posted there are some black wooden gates next to the White House. These, as you thought, lead into the open land of the Royal Hospital. It was originally to give access to a private house - Gordon House - but by the time of the murders this had long been a part of the hospital. In the second photo of the White House, there is a second set of gates, and these I believe would have given access to the rear of the Shelley House grounds.
                    So I think these gates were where the PC and Mellor entered the property. Sadly it's still not clear to me exactly where on the property the arm was found. But I would guess at the rear garden near the house. Which would indicate that the hospital grounds were easily accessible as that's where the leg would need to be thrown from.
                    Well, that's my thoughts, for what they're worth. Thanks again.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Abby Normal View Post
                      Awesome work jerry.
                      these views just exeplify that torsoman had the river at his disposal mere feet away the whole time from the bridge, yet waits a half mile to chuck it over a fence into someones yard.
                      And, not least, if he was dead set on throwing the leg into an estate along the Embankment, he seemingly had dozens of opportunities to do so well before he reached the Shelley estate! But he kept on to that leg for half a mile, walking or driving next to the river on his one side and a long line of properties and gardens to his other side.

                      Maybe he was very attached to that particular leg and found it hard to accept throwing it away?

                      Many thumbs up to Jerry and Joshua for a very enlightening show on this thread!

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                      • #12
                        Thanks Joshua, Abby and Christer!

                        This is how the property was laid out. I think you are correct about the stables, Joshua, which I have marked with a blue arrow. The green arrow, again, being Whistlers house, and the black arrow where I think the body was thrown over the bushes.

                        In Mellors account it was determined the package could not have been pushed through the railing from the estate side but was either placed there from the embankment side or tossed over the structure.

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                        • #13
                          This link shows the front of the Shelley House. With the mention of the theatre, I'm not quite sure which property it is? Tite street or embankment?

                          Download this stock image: PERCY BYSSHE SHELLEY English poet's house on the Chelsea Embankment: it contained a private theatre, where his play, The Cenci, was performed Date: 1792 - 1822 - G39H43 from Alamy's library of millions of high resolution stock photos, illustrations and vectors.

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                          • #14
                            Originally posted by jerryd View Post
                            This link shows the front of the Shelley House. With the mention of the theatre, I'm not quite sure which property it is? Tite street or embankment?

                            https://www.alamy.com/stock-photo-pe...105317187.html
                            I think this pic must be the original house front on the embankment; the door on the left jutting out looks just like the map.
                            The "dry moat" (sorry, not sure of the technical term) that it crosses is there too, as in the later version of the house, but very little if any garden on the front.

                            I was just checking out this book about Tite Street and it's inhabitants which has some good info on the theatre - it was apparently built on an empty lot in Tite Street, so didn't have a house in front but it's own inconspicuous frontage on the street.

                            The Street of Wonderful Possibilities

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                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Joshua Rogan View Post

                              I think this pic must be the original house front on the embankment; the door on the left jutting out looks just like the map.
                              The "dry moat" (sorry, not sure of the technical term) that it crosses is there too, as in the later version of the house, but very little if any garden on the front.

                              I was just checking out this book about Tite Street and it's inhabitants which has some good info on the theatre - it was apparently built on an empty lot in Tite Street, so didn't have a house in front but it's own inconspicuous frontage on the street.

                              The Street of Wonderful Possibilities
                              https://books.google.co.uk/books?id=...cation&f=false
                              Hi Joshua,

                              Just found this today. Matches exactly to the front picture we are discussing. The clipping also mentions the stables and garden.



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