Currency Question.

[Mike Covell]

During research into Robert D'Onston Stephenson and family, I discovered a cousin of Stephenson, who had been involved in fraud.

The Cousin in question was actually a Hull Solicitor, and was charged with stealing the following amounts of money, which vary in different press reports,

£5,600
£17,000
£14,000

The case came to court in 1891, and I was wondering if anyone knew the current value of these amounts in todays money??

[Crystal]

Hi Mike

Yes, here they are - the value depends on the indicator you use. 2007 values were the closest I could get - hope that's ok.

£5,600 = £438, 306.59 Retail Price Index
= £ 2, 628,410.22 Average Earnings

£14,000 = £ 1,095,766.48 RPI

=£6,571,025.66 AE

£17,000 = 1,330,573.58 RPI

= £7,979,102.45 AE

Best wishes

Crystal

[DVV]

Depends if it's entrusted to Madoff or to the Credit Lyonnais.

Amitiés,
David

[Mike Covell]

Thanks Crystal, much appreciated.

[DVV]

Hi Mike,
that's big money, isn't it ?
Wonderful family.
Hats off.

Amitiés,
David

[Crystal]

Speaking of big money, how much was Hutch's mythical £5 worth? Let's see if I can find an appropriate thread for the answer.

[Mike Covell]

It was a large amount of money, and it happened after Joseph Dawber, Robert D'Onston Stephenson's cousin, was entrusted with people's money, only to try to steal it.
Joseph was a solicitor, and had offices in Parliment Street, which is over looked by The Customs House, where Stephenson worked.

Anyway, Joseph, as a solicitor, was in charge of thousands of pounds by local businesses, businessmen, all the down to little old ladies. He tried to make off with the lot, but was discovered and had to stand trial.

One report I have covers a little old lady, who gave her life savings to Joseph, and he squandered the lot! She died penniless!

I am currently transcribing the newspaper reports covering the incident, and recently aquired the magistrates file.

This wasn't the first time the Dawber family got into trouble with the law, the earliest report and magistrates file is from 1840, when several of the family robbed a local builder!

[Bob Hinton]

Inflation

You don't say what year the offences were carried out. So here is the values from 1900.

£5,600 =£495,152
£17,000 = £1,503,140
£14,000= £ 1,237,880

Hutchinson's £5 would have been worth £442

[Mike Covell]

The case came to court in 1891, and I was wondering if anyone knew the current value of these amounts in todays money??

1891 Bob. The Court ordered that Joseph Dawber required 2 sureties of £1,000 each!

[John Savage]

Hi Mike,

I remember this case, and as Joseph Dawber was also the solicitor involved in the will of Richard Stephenson snr. [Donton's father] I have often wondered if this had anything to do with the fact that Richard left an estate valued at only £178. Did Joseph swidle his uncle I wonder?

Anyway Joseph got seven years penal servitude, and I did put the original article on the "From Hull" thread which was lost in the crash. [although I think it still remains on jtfforums in the "Savage on Donston" thread].

Unfortunately I cannot put up the report as these days the file is too large for current posting requirements.

Rgds
John

[Mike Covell]

Hi John,

Richard Stephenson died in January 1889 and up until this point, Joseph had quite a promising career, although it is possible that he was taking his uncle's money and holding it in trust, wouldn't the affair have come to light sooner?

That said, I suppose the family could have kept it quite.

In terms of Joseph Dawber's case I have the 4 newspaper reports, and massive magistrate file all transcribed now, it's quite long and goes into great detail. I also have a Driffield Times article from a month after the trial, showing some of the victims of fraud in Driffield!

I also have the 1840 Robert Dawber Snr and Robert Dawber Junior file all transcribed, this was possibly the largest case involving the family. Interestingly, as I was typing up the Robert Dawber case, I looked on National Archives and discovered they have more information there!

Some of the files I am working on can be seen here,

http://www.facebook.com/album.php?aid=52056&id=586989665&l=76945158a3

I have put in an estimation request to ascertain how much it will cost to view copies of the file.

[John Savage]

Hi Mike,

According to the Hull Daily Mail press reports of 1891, Joseph had become bankrupt [probably through discovery of his frauds] and his affairs had been investigated by the Official Receiver who stated that, "So far as they could ascertain he had been appropriating money since 1888".

It is therefore possible that Richard snr. could have been a victim, but by the time of the court case he was no longer around and that may have made investigating his affairs difficult, besdies which they had enough evidence for a conviction on the other frauds.

Rgds
John

[Mike Covell]

Hi Mike,

According to the Hull Daily Mail press reports of 1891, Joseph had become bankrupt [probably through discovery of his frauds] and his affairs had been investigated by the Official Receiver who stated that, "So far as they could ascertain he had been appropriating money since 1888".

Rgds
John

Hi John, what date was that report published? I have the May 21st 1891, Hull Daily Mail article which shows the events could have begun even earlier.
One witness claims 1886 as the time when Mr. Dawber began taking huge sums of money. I can scan the article if you don't have it.

[John Savage]

Hi Mike,

Without cranking up my old computer I cannot give you the exact date, but it was a report of the trial at York Assizes.

Having looked at the original photocopy I took of the article the year could well be 1886 - just a problem with old print and old eyes!

Rgds
John

[Mike Covell]

Hi Mike,
Having looked at the original photocopy I took of the article the year could well be 1886 - just a problem with old print and old eyes!
Rgds
John

I hear you, I printed a report off regarding the case which was short and only about 20 lines long, kind of a summary at the end of the week. The only problem is, there is a line running right along the centre from top to bottom, making every tenth word unreadable. It's like the bible code trying to decipher it.

I also have a few from the 1870's showing Richard Juniors political career, and the print is so bad, the words look like blobs, and they are unreadable.