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Accurate 13 Miller's Court Sketch

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  • Accurate 13 Miller's Court Sketch

    Of the few sketches of Mary Kelly's room that appeared in the newspapers at the time, they all vary widely in their dimensions and room furnishings. Is there any consensus on which sketch, if any, is the most accurate? Or, has anyone seen a modern sketch or rendering of the room that is based on the known facts? I'm looking for the best source to visually recreate the room as closely as possible.

  • #2
    I don,t believe there is a consensus, darkwood.
    Last edited by Robert St Devil; 06-21-2016, 12:37 PM.

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    • #3
      Check out this thread:

      http://forum.casebook.org/showthread.php?t=9308

      It's long, but worth a read through. Some great 3D renditions by poster richardh, plus drawings by others.

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      • #4
        Gray Darkwood, welcome to casebook.

        The answer is



        NO.
        G U T

        There are two ways to be fooled, one is to believe what isn't true, the other is to refuse to believe that which is true.

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        • #5
          And here's another, much shorter thread on Miller's Court:

          http://forum.casebook.org/showthread.php?t=9343

          Richardh did some 3D renderings where Miller's Court was located from pictures that were taken when the area was being demolished.

          Welcome to Casebook!

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          • #6
            If you can stand to look at the photograph of Mary's body on the bed, it will give you a little bit of an idea as to just how small, dingy, and dirty her room was.

            The newspaper sketches are probably pretty good for the exterior of Miller's Court, especially those based on photos, but I have seen one sketch of Mary's supposed bedroom which made it seem far too spacious, plus had supplied soft bedding and pillows for the bed! The artist apparently made it up completely.
            Pat D. https://forum.casebook.org/core/imag...rt/reading.gif
            ---------------
            Von Konigswald: Jack the Ripper plays shuffleboard. -- Happy Birthday, Wanda June by Kurt Vonnegut, c.1970.
            ---------------

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            • #7
              Dark, dirty and dingy indeed! It must have been truly awful to live in such conditions.
              On both the linked threads above there was such a lot of debate, argument, discussion about where everything was in Miller's Court and in Mary's room, length, width etc. But still no consensus!

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              • #8
                http://www.casebook.org/images/simonwood/image002.jpg

                About the size of a small bedroom.
                My name is Dave. You cannot reach me through Debs email account

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                • #9
                  Marys room was originally the Salon for #26, and the famed "partition wall" was erected to section it off from the house and add it to the courtyard. Primary access Im sure is the reason for the re-categorization.

                  The room is said to have been approximately 10 x 10, with the fireplace, the old hearth for the salon, opposite the access door to the courtyard. It was to be sure small and dingy, only getting sunlight later in the day. A far cry from the courtesan lifestyle when she was a brothel resident.
                  Michael Richards

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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Michael W Richards View Post
                    Marys room was originally the Salon for #26, and the famed "partition wall" was erected to section it off from the house and add it to the courtyard. Primary access Im sure is the reason for the re-categorization.

                    The room is said to have been approximately 10 x 10, with the fireplace, the old hearth for the salon, opposite the access door to the courtyard. It was to be sure small and dingy, only getting sunlight later in the day. A far cry from the courtesan lifestyle when she was a brothel resident.
                    Salon? Hahahahahaha, you crack me up Michael.

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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Observer View Post
                      Salon? Hahahahahaha, you crack me up Michael.
                      Id thought by now that an experienced poster would have known that already, but you are welcome to be self taught on this particular issue. The facts are discoverable here through various means..Im at work and cant guide you at this moment.
                      Michael Richards

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                      • #12
                        Hello MWR.

                        This thread should bury the one I'm about to post but I wanted to comment on your post. I agree.

                        I'd have to research it further but... I tend to think that the house, at one point, was a single family dwelling [many, many years prior]. I'd guess that as the dynamic of the East End changed with the wave of immigration over the years, the single dwelling house was partitioned off to serve as a multi-family rental dwelling. My suspicion is that, at one point, there was a large open area when you entered the house off of Dorsett St. In the front was a "living room" and towards the back was the "salon". I think this is supported by the comfort of a fireplace and two large windows that overlook the garden or courtyard. I believe the rooms were 'separated' by a staircase. My only deviation from the story is [I'm assuming here] that there were two walls added later on. The first wall... we know about. I think it extended off of the staircase and created the inner wall of No.13 [Mary Jane's room]. But I think there was a second wall added off the other side of the staircase, which converted "the living room" into its own separate space. This room would become the McCarthy's storage room. The two walls created a hallway leading to the stairs off the passageway. In order to accommodate for this hallway, another door was added... in addition to the one created for No. 13.

                        Best of luck if you continue with Casebook, Darkwood.

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                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Darkwood View Post
                          Of the few sketches of Mary Kelly's room that appeared in the newspapers at the time, they all vary widely in their dimensions and room furnishings. Is there any consensus on which sketch, if any, is the most accurate? Or, has anyone seen a modern sketch or rendering of the room that is based on the known facts? I'm looking for the best source to visually recreate the room as closely as possible.
                          It occurs to me you might also find some good images in the graphic novel From Hell by Alan Moore and illustrated by Eddie Campbell. Eddie did do some research and has the room and its furnishings fairly close to the descriptions we have of the place.

                          https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/From_Hell

                          Good luck, Darkwood!
                          Pat D. https://forum.casebook.org/core/imag...rt/reading.gif
                          ---------------
                          Von Konigswald: Jack the Ripper plays shuffleboard. -- Happy Birthday, Wanda June by Kurt Vonnegut, c.1970.
                          ---------------

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                          • #14
                            My room (SRO in a converted hotel) is 8x12 and I have a refrigerator & a sink! (No fireplace, though- radiator & they overheat the building.)

                            - CFL

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                            • #15
                              Originally posted by C. F. Leon View Post
                              My room (SRO in a converted hotel) is 8x12 and I have a refrigerator & a sink! (No fireplace, though- radiator & they overheat the building.)

                              - CFL
                              Yep. When I lived on a RAAF base room was about 12x10.
                              G U T

                              There are two ways to be fooled, one is to believe what isn't true, the other is to refuse to believe that which is true.

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