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  • Seaside Home

    Hi All,

    I think this has been mentioned before on a lost thread, but it's still nonetheless interesting—from The Times, Feb 29th 1896.

    A Dover seaside convalescent home founded in 1882 for, among others, City of London policeman.

    Regards,

    Simon

    Click image for larger version

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    Never believe anything until it has been officially denied.

  • #2
    Thanks Simon. Very nice post.

    Mike
    huh?

    Comment


    • #3
      Hi Simon,
      I found this interesting too, I have a few bits about it that I looked at last year, checking the census entries etc to see how many City Police were actually resident there prior to the permanent wing they had built in the 1890's.
      I still had this pic on my comp. too so thought I may as well post it, I've lost the reference for the date and newspaper source though.
      Debs

      Click image for larger version

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      ,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸, Debs ,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,

      I am not DJA. He's called Dave.

      Comment


      • #4
        With regard to the Hove Seaside home the page below might be of interest:

        http://www.stgeorgesharrogate.org/stg01gurney.htm

        Comment


        • #5
          Thats not far from my neck of the woods, Harrogate was a popular destination for camping, hikking, mountain bikking and canoiing as kids.

          Didn't teach us how to spell though!!

          This ite might be of intrest,

          http://homepage.ntlworld.com/hitch/gendocs/police.html
          Regards Mike

          Comment


          • #6
            Hi All,

            Great finds, one and all.

            This is from "The Climates and Baths of Great Britain" (1895) —

            "Patients convalescing after operations, and suffering from the debility consequent on fevers, do remarkably well at the Morley Convalescent Home."

            Let's spice things up with a bit of Royal conspiracy (only kidding!).

            This is from "The Nursing Record Hospital World Supplement" (Sept 7th 1893)—

            "The Queen has presented an engraving of her full length portrait, with her Majesty's autograph, to the Morley Convalescent Home (Dover). The Committee have had the work handsomely framed and hung in the day-room of the new wing."

            And who do we find at a Morley House meeting at the Guildhall, on Saturday, June 6th 1891?

            None other than our old friend Colonel Henry Smith "(Chief Commissioner, City Police, a certain number of the beds being reserved for the force.)"—see attachment, The Times, June 8th 1891.

            Regards,

            Simon

            Click image for larger version

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            Never believe anything until it has been officially denied.

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            • #7
              Hi All,

              Swanson wrote in his marginalia about a Seaside Home where Kosminski was sent with "difficulty."

              I have always wondered what that "difficulty" might have been, and so I offer you this thought.

              If Swanson's Seaside Home was Morley House, Dover—with beds reserved for the City Police—could the "difficulty" have been the Metropolitan Police attempting the identification without alerting the City Police to the fact they had a suspect?

              As I say, it's just a thought.

              Regards,

              Simon
              Never believe anything until it has been officially denied.

              Comment


              • #8
                Good thoughts, Simon, and my thanks for reviving this subject.
                But I think the problem we do face is that everyone automatically assumes that Swanson was referring to a 'police' convalescent home, when he wasn't, he was referring to a 'Seaside Home'... so there might well be no police connection at all.
                That it was connected to the police - City or otherwise - is an assumption.

                My own connective mind suggests to me that the fact that Thomas Cutbush's relatives were prone to send young Thomas down to Margate whenever he was in trouble would seem to indicate that the various Seaside Homes at Margate for the convalescence of Londoners might be more profitable in this regard.
                My money is on this.

                Comment


                • #9
                  That's the type of thought I had Simon that made me want to look closer at Morley House, that, or maybe that the 'city P.C. witness' mistake might not have been a mistake...just thoughts though, as you say...

                  Here's the census address of the home btw, it's a bit different to the newspaper address:

                  Convalescent Home, Rose Bank, St Margaret At Cliffe, West Cliffe, Dover

                  Charles Bray was the master of the home in 1891, I can't find what I had found out for 1881. In looking for occassional City Police use prior to them getting their own wing there in the 90's I could only find one P.C. in 1891, Charles Anoot(?) I never did find out which force he belonged to though.


                  Debs
                  ,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸, Debs ,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,

                  I am not DJA. He's called Dave.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Another link about the Hove Seaside Home:

                    http://www.npch.org/history2.htm
                    “Sans arme, sans violence et sans haine”

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      There's also this possibility

                      1892 (228) Select Committee on Belfast Corporation (Lunatic Asylums, etc.) Bill. Report, Proceedings, Evidence, Index

                      Q&A format

                      1097. The convalescent home required for Belfast would be a small seaside institution?-
                      Yes, many of the lunatic asylums in England have convalescent homes attached to them now.

                      Seemingly, some small seaside convalescent homes were a bridge between the lunatic asylum and a return to home and community for some patients.
                      ,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸, Debs ,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,

                      I am not DJA. He's called Dave.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Hello all

                        I was stunned that I was the only bidder on the following postcard on ebay, the bidding for which has just closed.

                        1900's Postcard Hove Brighton

                        Here is the description. I would be interested to know if anyone finds errors in this statement ... and let me say that I don't necessarily totally buy the scenario that the seller posits -- but I post it for your reaction.

                        I am planning to use the postcard view in my upcoming book on Jack the Ripper and the Jews.

                        "1900's Postcard Police Seaside Home Hove Brighton - Jack the ripper - Aaron Kosminski is one of only two suspects (the other being Joseph Barnett) against whom there is real evidence or testimony. The case against Kosminski is stronger than many of us who believe in alternate theories are generally prepared to admit -- it is even stronger than those who suspect Kosminski usually dare to argue. In particular, those who suspect Kosminski elevate the opinions of Dr. Robert Anderson to such Olympian heights that newcomers can get the impression Kosminski is only important as 'Anderson's Suspect.' In fact, Kosminski makes a perfectly respectable suspect whether or not Anderson ever heard his name. The Jewish Convalescent Home (in 1891 directories onwards) in the West Brighton and Hove areas, was otherwise known as the Jewish Children's Convalescent Home, 35 Montgomery Street. Montgomery Street and Claredon Villas. It was less than 200 yards apart of where the Police Seaside Home stood. The Records of the Convalescent Home have not apparently survived, but it is possible that the suspect was taken here first, held overnight, and then taken across to the Police Seaside Home at Claredon Villas. If the workhouse authorities were the ones transporting Kosminski to the Seaside Home, would they then unquestionably hand him over to the police, as has been suggested? With this possibility, we have to ask if the Kosminski suspect was actually incarcerated at this point, because as Swanson maintained, the suspect was taken 'with difficulty' to the identification site. I believe he was arrested, not committed, but this was not the source of the 'difficulty' that Swanson referred to. It is more likely that the police took an ill suspect from his brother's house 60 miles or so to the Jewish Convalescent Home (one-day ride by cab from London). There, he would have been examined the following day by doctors, escorted to the adjacent Seaside Home and then subjected to the identification (likely a one-day event), and returned to London the following day, for a total of three days (February 24-26, 1891). As suggested above, this difficulty may have had something to do with the (separate) transport of the witness as well, especially a witness whom possibly lived on the border of two police jurisdictions in which the crimes occurred."

                        Best regards

                        Chris
                        Christopher T. George
                        Editor, Ripperologist
                        http://www.ripperologist.biz
                        http://chrisgeorge.netpublish.net

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Chris George View Post
                          Here is the description. I would be interested to know if anyone finds errors in this statement ... and let me say that I don't necessarily totally buy the scenario that the seller posits -- but I post it for your reaction.
                          Much of it is lifted from Scott Nelson's dissertation, "An Alternate Kosminski Suspect and Police Witness: Some Perspectives and Points to Ponder", on this site:
                          http://www.casebook.org/dissertations/kosfinal.html

                          [Edit: Actually, if I understand correctly, in the part that is quoted, Scott was discussing the hypothesis that it was _another_ Kozminski, not Aaron, who was taken to the Seaside Home.]
                          Last edited by Chris; 06-13-2008, 11:13 AM.

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                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Chris George View Post

                            Here is the description. I would be interested to know if anyone finds errors in this statement ... and let me say that I don't necessarily totally buy the scenario that the seller posits -- but I post it for your reaction.


                            Originally posted by Chris View Post
                            Much of it is lifted from Scott Nelson's dissertation, "An Alternate Kosminski Suspect and Police Witness: Some Perspectives and Points to Ponder", on this site:
                            http://www.casebook.org/dissertations/kosfinal.html

                            [Edit: Actually, if I understand correctly, in the part that is quoted, Scott was discussing the hypothesis that it was _another_ Kozminski, not Aaron, who was taken to the Seaside Home.]

                            Thanks, Chris.
                            Christopher T. George
                            Editor, Ripperologist
                            http://www.ripperologist.biz
                            http://chrisgeorge.netpublish.net

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Hi Chris,

                              Just a small point.
                              The article you quote suggests that Kosminski was taken to Brighton in a one day cab journey.

                              Why take a cab when there would have been a perfectly good train service, taking only one or two hours?

                              Rgds
                              John

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