The FBI Profile of Jack the Ripper & it's usefulness

[curious4]

Normal fetuses rarely got pickled. They rarely get pickled today. Conjoined twins, sure.

Though it is worth pointing out that the fetus was not pickled. Merely in a jar resembling a pickle jar. And really crammed in there to boot, since a 5 or 6 mo. old fetus does not easily fit in the average pickling jar.

Hello Errata

Well, obviously not in jam jars! And I believe the "pickling" was in formaldehyde (not that I ever opened one to smell it). These were purpose made, like the ones you used to see in old museums, and not for freak shows, these were for teaching purposes.

Best wishes
C4

[Abby Normal]

Serial killers are extremely compulsive by nature. Not that there aren't people who would rip the face off of anyone they encounter, but they aren't serial killers. They end up as mass murderers or spree killers.

Serial killers do what they do for a reason. Not a good reason, but a reason. They obey the rules of their fantasies. Which sounds like delusion, and rarely is in fact delusion. But mostly it is a lack of... not impulse control exactly, but the inability or unwillingness to resist compulsion. They "want" to do something, it turns into "need", they do it. It satisfies them.

Jack the Ripper did not kill only to procure organs. He killed because he had an elaborate fantasy in his head that he needed to recreate. The fantasy gave him pleasure or relief, acting on it... more so. The fantasy included taking organs. He did. But one of the interesting parts of this mystery is that Jack has a tough time prioritizing. Take the Eyeball Killer. Just from the name you know what his priority was. He had an elaborate fantasy, but if he could not replicate that, he would still take the eyes. The eyes were the most important part. You can tell what murder victims were his by, if nothing else, the fact that the eyes were removed.

Jack the Ripper is tough. If we accept that he killed 5 or 6 women (the C5 plus maybe Tabram) then we have some real problems figuring out what this guy was after. Was he targeting middle aged prostitutes? Maybe, except that Kelly was not middle aged, and we don't know that all of these women were working prostitutes. Women with brown hair seems like way too big a victim pool, and two victims did not have brown hair. Nor were they all the same body type. It might have been a voice thing, but we have no way of knowing that.

And if we look at the murders themselves, the problems get bigger. Any idiot can see that if a man takes the time to burrow in there and grab a uterus, thats significant. But if that was the purpose, why did he fail 3 out of 5 times? If it's important, if that's what makes it worth it, he doesn't leave that behind. And he did. And he evidently spent just as much time sawing away at the throats of these women (after they were dead) as he did getting into the abdomens. The throat cut was not just a way to kill. He kept going. And going. The throat is significant. The abdomen is significant. Facial mutilations are significant. The posing may be significant. And I can't even a little think of any other serial killer with so many primary focuses. If these women had been been alive when these things were done, that might make sense to me. It's a basic form of torture. But they were dead.

Eyeball Killer had a fantasy, but the eyeballs were the focus. For Damher, the victims body type and the desire to control his victims were the focus. For Bundy, it was victim type and sadism. Son of Sam, terrorism. For Gein, this was the only acceptable contact with women that he had. For Jack... the organs, the throat the abdomen, the face, the post mortem behavior, the rush... and too many focuses is no focus. Jack had no focus. Everything was apparently equally important, so nothing was important, and that doesn't happen. So we are clearly missing something. I mean, we are missing a lot, but the statement that the Ripper only killed to procure organs is just massively untrue. And frankly, kind of dumb.

Every time I think about this particular aspect, I become convinced that there are two killers working together, despite the fact I really don't believe that to be true.

it was all about the knife, and what it/he could do to the female body. the organ removal was for reliving it.

[Jon Guy]

it was all about the knife, and what it/he could do to the female body. the organ removal was for reliving it.

I`d say that the ripping of the skin was the main buzz.
Sawing through the throat, ripping open the abdomen, removing the flesh off the arms and legs, removing the breasts, and mutilating the face.

[Errata]

Hello Errata

Well, obviously not in jam jars! And I believe the "pickling" was in formaldehyde (not that I ever opened one to smell it). These were purpose made, like the ones you used to see in old museums, and not for freak shows, these were for teaching purposes.

Best wishes
C4

No, fetuses were totally pickled in formaldehyde. But the fetus that was in the jar was not pickled. Just in a jar that "resembled those used for pickling". But I seem to recall the wording was such that it was trying to carefully say that the fetus was not pickled, despite the fact the jar was used for pickling.

[Errata]

it was all about the knife, and what it/he could do to the female body. the organ removal was for reliving it.

Maybe, but the pursuit of a purely tactile sensation would involve quite a bit more knife work. The pursuit of a specific visual or aesthetic would require a specific kind of "canvas". So he would still be all over the place.

And an organ is never a trophy. It's always significant. If an organ is a trophy, any organ is a trophy. And not only do we not see that here, I can't recall seeing it anywhere. This is not easy. Cutting out the uterus is difficult and rather messy. Never mind the stench.

[Bridewell]

In 1988, any child could get his hands on matches or a cigarette lighter. Things were different a century before. Lanterns were the province of the middle-classes

Not exclusively so. Albert Cadosch's youngest daughter set fire to her nightdress when she overturned an oil lamp. (She was not 'playing with matches' as claimed in the article). She was lucky to survive and bore the scars for the rest of her life. She was most definitely working class.

[Rosella]

I've been trying to find the price of matches in 1888 and been unsuccessful. If they were sold in boxes of fifty at a time at say 3 pence a box, that wouldn't be beyond a working man's pocket.

I know Cadosch had not been well, but if he was in full time employment there would have been boxes of matches in his home, and, as that news item shows, there were some used to light the oil lamp.

Unfortunately, those sort of accidents when there were lots of open fires and oil lamps and candles in the home, were extremely common.

[SirJohnFalstaff]

I've been trying to find the price of matches in 1888 and been unsuccessful. If they were sold in boxes of fifty at a time at say 3 pence a box, that wouldn't be beyond a working man's pocket.

Some people made matches at home, in order to sell them.

[Michael W Richards]

Hey all,
Wanted to get your thoughts about what you think about the FBI profile of Jack the Ripper written by FBI Agent/Profiler John E. Douglas. What do you think we can derive from it? How can we use it as a tool in our search for the Ripper?
I know there are things in there which some may poo poo and some who think profiling is useless. But I would add FBI profilers were instrumental in helping Kansas police to catch Dennis Rader, known as the BTK Killer.

Here is the link for the FBI "Jack the Ripper" profile:

http://vault.fbi.gov/Jack%20the%20Ripper

-Paul

Almost every one consulted over the years about these crimes began with a premise that they were looking for the killer of the five Canonical victims,...as if that group was an established run of murders by one man. It isn't, never was, and might never be. Its five murders, among some 11 in the Unsolved Murders file from the period.

If people could detach themselves from the JtR urban legend they might be better able to see the facts as they are, not as they have been assumed to be.

Ive spoken with detectives who work on serial murders, one whom worked on one of Canada most famous cases. Ive been informed that without an arrest, many murders cannot be empirically assigned to any single killer....so why have we been assuming that 5 of that 11 should be? Particularly when the physical evidence doesn't support that argument.

Cheers

[Trevor Marriott]

Almost every one consulted over the years about these crimes began with a premise that they were looking for the killer of the five Canonical victims,...as if that group was an established run of murders by one man. It isn't, never was, and might never be. Its five murders, among some 11 in the Unsolved Murders file from the period.

If people could detach themselves from the JtR urban legend they might be better able to see the facts as they are, not as they have been assumed to be.

Ive spoken with detectives who work on serial murders, one whom worked on one of Canada most famous cases. Ive been informed that without an arrest, many murders cannot be empirically assigned to any single killer....so why have we been assuming that 5 of that 11 should be? Particularly when the physical evidence doesn't support that argument.

Cheers

Excellent post Michael right on the money.

[Simon Wood]

Hi Michael,

Many thanks for your refreshing gust of common sense.

Regards,

Simon

[c.d.]

You'll forgive me if I have a different take on Michael's post. I think if anyone does not accept the C5 as having been the work of one man it is because they arbitrarily assign rules of conduct that a serial killer must somehow follow and attribute importance to differences in the killings which are not significant. For them, Jack has to act like a robot not a human being.

c.d.

[lynn cates]

sacred number

Hello CD. OK, but what is sacred about the C5? In fact, many people who are convinced that there was a serial killer about in the East End are inclined to add Tabram or McKenzie or Coles.

Stewart Evans has said that, if he had to swear, he would say three.

Cheers.
LC

[Simon Wood]

Hi All,

What is the minimum number of victims required to qualify as a serial killer?

Regards,

Simon

[Trevor Marriott]

Hi All,

What is the minimum number of victims required to qualify as a serial killer?

Regards,

Simon

Hi Simon 3