Was Syphilis the cause of JtR's insanity and motive?

[Patrick Differ]

This has probably been examined before but I struggle with cause of these murders like everyone else. If the Ripper was a criminal lunatic as suspected, then what does that even mean? And does this affect the Suspect list?

i've seen different statistics on Syphilis rates in London and the stat 1 in 4 of every male had Syphilis. That appears to be an epidemic without any cure other than mercury treatments and hygiene like topical baths and sea air as examples. There were serious studies out of France by Fourier and Ricord at this time and its pretty detailed. There was a serious effort to treat the virus early and perhaps improve birth rates.

However it does not appear there was great success with mercury, and unless you treated it from the beginning and kept up treatments under a Doctors care you were at risk for death at an early age. This could also explain why the Ripper murders stopped.

A person can be a criminal but not suffering mental illness. And the reverse is true. But a person can also become a criminal lunatic as theft, murder, rape, arson and other crimes are often linked to serial killers. Was JtR a criminal who graduated to murder or a lunatic who was triggered by something like a medical condition ( Syphilis) and just started to murder without any prior sadistic or immoral type behaviors?

There was little if any psychiatric definition in 1888 to classify this type of murder by the Ripper. Certainly the Police and Doctors had never witnessed it. Today the murders are considered psychosocial murders with subcategories. But these are just ways to explain medically for modern treatment. Still, they point to a classification and now have 135 years of history to quantify it. So how did the Ripper get there?

The clear culprit in my mind would be untreated Syphilis. Left untreated it can produce all sorts of harmful behaviors- hallucinations, paranoia, hearing voices, memory loss, impulsiveness,violence, insomnia, balance and more. It could cause schizophrenia. The triggers for crime are many and could be induced by something like stress or death of a loved one or even suppressed memory like trauma from childhood.

JtR became sexually satisfied when he performed the asphyxiation, the cutting of the throat and mutilation. These 3 acts are all individually classified today as part of the goal of the perpetrator.

This type of murder fantasy includes the need for domination and control. That occured the moment the Victim says yes. Chapman and Kelly were apparently heard saying Yes in some manner. This started the Lust sequence in 3 phases. Once completed the killer simply walks away. Its possible that he was even unaware or immediately detached until he got home.

Syphilis was a serious issue in 1888 and while it could be treated it would disappear giving the person a false belief that it had disappeared permanently.Only to reappear a decade later and cause..perhaps a sufferer to become both a lunatic and a criminal.

JtR came out of nowhere presumably and unlike most serial killers he was only committing murders in Whitechapel in a quarter mile area for less than a year. Although I believe McKenzie was his last murder.

Could the later stages of Syphilis left untreated and some trigger or triggers suddenly cause this basically 4 month onslaught?

Interested in feedback here. JtR was certainly carrying out a Sexual fantasy. He was certainly insane. But he could also control it.

[c.d.]

Could the later stages of Syphilis left untreated and some trigger or triggers suddenly cause this basically 4 month onslaught?

Possibly. Can we say for certain that that was the cause? No.

He was certainly insane. But he could also control it.

I am not so sure I would agree with insane. Don't get me wrong. He was an extremely sick and disturbed individual but I am not sure we can conclude he was insane. He was rational enough to evade capture.

"Insane" is a tricky diagnosis. Look at Jeffrey Dahmer for instance. He did things far worse than Jack and a jury determined that he was sane when he did these things.

c.d.

[Barnaby]

I don't want to say "likely" because there is no way to know, but certainly it is reasonable. End-stage syphilis is one way to (somewhat) explain these murders and their rather abrupt cessation. Jacob Levy is a good suspect in this vein.

[Abby Normal]

This has probably been examined before but I struggle with cause of these murders like everyone else. If the Ripper was a criminal lunatic as suspected, then what does that even mean? And does this affect the Suspect list?

i've seen different statistics on Syphilis rates in London and the stat 1 in 4 of every male had Syphilis. That appears to be an epidemic without any cure other than mercury treatments and hygiene like topical baths and sea air as examples. There were serious studies out of France by Fourier and Ricord at this time and its pretty detailed. There was a serious effort to treat the virus early and perhaps improve birth rates.

However it does not appear there was great success with mercury, and unless you treated it from the beginning and kept up treatments under a Doctors care you were at risk for death at an early age. This could also explain why the Ripper murders stopped.

A person can be a criminal but not suffering mental illness. And the reverse is true. But a person can also become a criminal lunatic as theft, murder, rape, arson and other crimes are often linked to serial killers. Was JtR a criminal who graduated to murder or a lunatic who was triggered by something like a medical condition ( Syphilis) and just started to murder without any prior sadistic or immoral type behaviors?

There was little if any psychiatric definition in 1888 to classify this type of murder by the Ripper. Certainly the Police and Doctors had never witnessed it. Today the murders are considered psychosocial murders with subcategories. But these are just ways to explain medically for modern treatment. Still, they point to a classification and now have 135 years of history to quantify it. So how did the Ripper get there?

The clear culprit in my mind would be untreated Syphilis. Left untreated it can produce all sorts of harmful behaviors- hallucinations, paranoia, hearing voices, memory loss, impulsiveness,violence, insomnia, balance and more. It could cause schizophrenia. The triggers for crime are many and could be induced by something like stress or death of a loved one or even suppressed memory like trauma from childhood.

JtR became sexually satisfied when he performed the asphyxiation, the cutting of the throat and mutilation. These 3 acts are all individually classified today as part of the goal of the perpetrator.

This type of murder fantasy includes the need for domination and control. That occured the moment the Victim says yes. Chapman and Kelly were apparently heard saying Yes in some manner. This started the Lust sequence in 3 phases. Once completed the killer simply walks away. Its possible that he was even unaware or immediately detached until he got home.

Syphilis was a serious issue in 1888 and while it could be treated it would disappear giving the person a false belief that it had disappeared permanently.Only to reappear a decade later and cause..perhaps a sufferer to become both a lunatic and a criminal.

JtR came out of nowhere presumably and unlike most serial killers he was only committing murders in Whitechapel in a quarter mile area for less than a year. Although I believe McKenzie was his last murder.

Could the later stages of Syphilis left untreated and some trigger or triggers suddenly cause this basically 4 month onslaught?

Interested in feedback here. JtR was certainly carrying out a Sexual fantasy. He was certainly insane. But he could also control it.

hi patrick
i agree with what cd said, but i would add his motive was probably like most serial killers, he derived some kind of pleasure from it. and there was probably a sexual part to it, eventhough it was not overt and there was no signs of sexual abuse. i shudder to think what he did with the internal organs he took.

[Patrick Differ]

Honestly I had no idea how pervasive immorality was in Victorian London or how women were treated until I got into Ripper research. It certainly takes you down many different roads. Words like lunatic and insane conjur up different thoughts and emotions and its not easy to distill or simplify.
Syphilis is likely one explanation for an episode resulting in murder, and it makes you wonder how many suspects likely had it and as such became part of the motive. Revenge and blame..
On the other hand Cocaine, widely available and considered a miracle drug at the time, and indeed other drugs, could also cause psychotic behavior. ive known people unfortunately that have become mentally ill and even incapacitated on some level from drug use. Charles Manson and LSD resulted in serial murders.
Curious to know what the consensus might be regarding this avenue at looking at Heredity, disease , drugs and even environmental ( growing up Whitechapel) as primary factors that spawned the killer. And how many suspects had these known drivers?

[John Wheat]

Honestly I had no idea how pervasive immorality was in Victorian London or how women were treated until I got into Ripper research. It certainly takes you down many different roads. Words like lunatic and insane conjur up different thoughts and emotions and its not easy to distill or simplify.
Syphilis is likely one explanation for an episode resulting in murder, and it makes you wonder how many suspects likely had it and as such became part of the motive. Revenge and blame..
On the other hand Cocaine, widely available and considered a miracle drug at the time, and indeed other drugs, could also cause psychotic behavior. ive known people unfortunately that have become mentally ill and even incapacitated on some level from drug use. Charles Manson and LSD resulted in serial murders.
Curious to know what the consensus might be regarding this avenue at looking at Heredity, disease , drugs and even environmental ( growing up Whitechapel) as primary factors that spawned the killer. And how many suspects had these known drivers?

Hi Patrick

Great post. However it's easy to get the impression that London at the time was full of violent knife murders however this is completely untrue. Actual violent knife murder was in fact extremely rare.

Cheers John

[Wickerman]

....

The clear culprit in my mind would be untreated Syphilis. Left untreated it can produce all sorts of harmful behaviors- hallucinations, paranoia, hearing voices, memory loss, impulsiveness,violence, insomnia, balance and more. It could cause schizophrenia. The triggers for crime are many and could be induced by something like stress or death of a loved one or even suppressed memory like trauma from childhood....

I realize you are looking at his mental state, but there is also physical traits, my preferred suspect was described as having peculiar eyes, or weak eyes, like he had no eyelashes.
That sounds like Maderosis, a symptom of Syphilis.

[Fiver]

Hi Patrick

Great post. However it's easy to get the impression that London at the time was full of violent knife murders however this is completely untrue. Actual violent knife murder was in fact extremely rare.

Cheers John

And most of those knife murders were stabbings. Throat cutting much less common.

[Holmes' Idiot Brother]

About two years ago, I had a Behavioral Health patient come into my hospital for an assessment. What made him memorable was the fact that he had never been diagnosed with the usual "schizophrenia/conduct disorder/anti-social personality disorder/etc., etc." His drug scans were completely negative, which surprised us all, because we were under the impression that he may have been on "bath salts" or "K-2." He would be completely calm and lucid one moment, then fly into a rage where we would have to physically apply restraints to him. After his outbursts, he would claim no memory of them, and he was often confused for some time after his meltdowns. Well, you guessed it, the man turned out to have end-stage syphilis! He exhibited every one of the aforementioned symptoms, and his behavior bordered on the criminal. JTR could well have been a syphilitic, perhaps contracting it from a prostitute, and decided to rid the world of these women. The patient I described died quite soon and unexpectedly after his arrival, and it's certainly possible that the Ripper with end-stage syphilis met the same fate.

[c.d.]

An interesting side note -- America's most notorious gangster Al Capone was let out of prison before his sentence was due to end as it was determined that he was suffering from the effects of untreated late stage Syphilis and the court determined that he had basically become childlike and no longer posed a threat to anyone.

The anniversary of The St. Valentine's Day Massacre in Chicago in 1929 is coming up this Friday. If you get a chance to see the documentary on it (not the movie) it is fascinating. Highly recommended. On tv from time to time.

c.d.

[I1ariusz]

About two years ago, I had a Behavioral Health patient come into my hospital for an assessment. What made him memorable was the fact that he had never been diagnosed with the usual "schizophrenia/conduct disorder/anti-social personality disorder/etc., etc." His drug scans were completely negative, which surprised us all, because we were under the impression that he may have been on "bath salts" or "K-2." He would be completely calm and lucid one moment, then fly into a rage where we would have to physically apply restraints to him. After his outbursts, he would claim no memory of them, and he was often confused for some time after his meltdowns. Well, you guessed it, the man turned out to have end-stage syphilis! He exhibited every one of the aforementioned symptoms, and his behavior bordered on the criminal. JTR could well have been a syphilitic, perhaps contracting it from a prostitute, and decided to rid the world of these women. The patient I described died quite soon and unexpectedly after his arrival, and it's certainly possible that the Ripper with end-stage syphilis met the same fate.

Hello, that's an interesting observation. Although Ripper was rational enought to evade capture he could've been infected. I don't think it was all of his ilness - we can clearly see that what he exhibited was fueled by some deep and elaborated fantasies. Nevertheless interesting. Speaking about this I was always interested in connection between schizophrenia and violence - when it happens it often shows very strong aspect of cruelty and barbarism.

[C. F. Leon]

This has probably been examined before but I struggle with cause of these murders like everyone else. If the Ripper was a criminal lunatic as suspected, then what does that even mean? And does this affect the Suspect list?

i've seen different statistics on Syphilis rates in London and the stat 1 in 4 of every male had Syphilis. That appears to be an epidemic without any cure other than mercury treatments and hygiene like topical baths and sea air as examples. There were serious studies out of France by Fourier and Ricord at this time and its pretty detailed. There was a serious effort to treat the virus early and perhaps improve birth rates.

However it does not appear there was great success with mercury, and unless you treated it from the beginning and kept up treatments under a Doctors care you were at risk for death at an early age. This could also explain why the Ripper murders stopped.

A person can be a criminal but not suffering mental illness. And the reverse is true. But a person can also become a criminal lunatic as theft, murder, rape, arson and other crimes are often linked to serial killers. Was JtR a criminal who graduated to murder or a lunatic who was triggered by something like a medical condition ( Syphilis) and just started to murder without any prior sadistic or immoral type behaviors?

There was little if any psychiatric definition in 1888 to classify this type of murder by the Ripper. Certainly the Police and Doctors had never witnessed it. Today the murders are considered psychosocial murders with subcategories. But these are just ways to explain medically for modern treatment. Still, they point to a classification and now have 135 years of history to quantify it. So how did the Ripper get there?

The clear culprit in my mind would be untreated Syphilis. Left untreated it can produce all sorts of harmful behaviors- hallucinations, paranoia, hearing voices, memory loss, impulsiveness,violence, insomnia, balance and more. It could cause schizophrenia. The triggers for crime are many and could be induced by something like stress or death of a loved one or even suppressed memory like trauma from childhood.

JtR became sexually satisfied when he performed the asphyxiation, the cutting of the throat and mutilation. These 3 acts are all individually classified today as part of the goal of the perpetrator.

This type of murder fantasy includes the need for domination and control. That occured the moment the Victim says yes. Chapman and Kelly were apparently heard saying Yes in some manner. This started the Lust sequence in 3 phases. Once completed the killer simply walks away. Its possible that he was even unaware or immediately detached until he got home.

Syphilis was a serious issue in 1888 and while it could be treated it would disappear giving the person a false belief that it had disappeared permanently.Only to reappear a decade later and cause..perhaps a sufferer to become both a lunatic and a criminal.

JtR came out of nowhere presumably and unlike most serial killers he was only committing murders in Whitechapel in a quarter mile area for less than a year. Although I believe McKenzie was his last murder.

Could the later stages of Syphilis left untreated and some trigger or triggers suddenly cause this basically 4 month onslaught?

Interested in feedback here. JtR was certainly carrying out a Sexual fantasy. He was certainly insane. But he could also control it.

This is nothing new. It is the basis of Leonard Matters' "Dr. Stanley" theory, as set forth in his 1929 book, The Mystery of Jack the Ripper.

For more details in the prevalence of Syphilis in Victorian England & its "Treatments", see Podcast #61: "Opening Pandora's Box: Syphilis in Whitechapel 1888" (Robert Anderson; 2014)

Several other podcasts cover the Syphilis issue, such as "Dracula Meets the Ripper" (Clive Bloom; 2016).

- CFL

[Patrick Differ]

Hi CF..I doubted it was a new topic and would have been surprised if it was. Will look at the Stanley theory. Appreciate that. I have read what the two leading authorities at that time Fourier and Ricord published so there were very detailed studies at the time. I would be very surprised if the Ripper were not infected. Something triggered it and probably a combination of factors.
Did Israel Schwartz see a man with a syphiltic gait or someone who had been drinking? The possibilities are endless.
Cheers.

[The Rookie Detective]

There's always going to be a valid argument as to the killer's mental health; psychopathy, lunacy etc...

I am sure we can all agree that he was at the very least; a very disturbed individual.

However the physical aspects of the murders are often overlooked due to the focus being on the killers perceived mindset.

For example; if Stride was a Ripper victim; how could a man suffering from the physically devastating impact of syphilis have the physical strength to almost decapitate Stride with just 1 throat cut?

The killer displays immense strength for the murder of Stride because trying to decapitate his victim would require immense strength and force.

This could perhaps be achieved if the killer used something as leverage, in order to make that severity of cut in just a single attempt, but even then, the killer needed strength to achieve what he did.

Unless of course, the killer suffered from a form of disassociative mental health condition, whereby he appeared weak and puny, but was then able to produce immense strength from another personality taking over to dominate.

It sounds a little far-fetched perhaps, but there are real life cases whereby a killer has exhibited multi personalities (not quite the same as schizophrenia) and has been able to appear as someone completely different, including different accents and enhanced physical attributes.

I think this is unlikely, and that the simpler explanation is that the Ripper was a stout powerful man with formidable strength.

A butcher, dock worker, builder, navvy, sailor, manual labourer etc...

The idea that a man could be suffering from syphilis and then be able to almost take Stride's head off in complete silence and with just 1 cut; is frankly ridiculous.

The killer was physically powerful.

He had to have been.

Especially if he was used to carrying parcels containing torso parts all over the place.

[C. F. Leon]

Hi CF..I doubted it was a new topic and would have been surprised if it was. Will look at the Stanley theory. Appreciate that. I have read what the two leading authorities at that time Fourier and Ricord published so there were very detailed studies at the time. I would be very surprised if the Ripper were not infected. Something triggered it and probably a combination of factors.
Did Israel Schwartz see a man with a syphiltic gait or someone who had been drinking? The possibilities are endless.
Cheers.

Matters' book has been long out-of-print and because it includes photos of the murder locations, an undamaged copy is hard to find. I ordered it through Interlibrary Loan on two separate occasions several years ago, and received two different copies- one intact and the other with the photo pages missing. There is a paperback edition, but I don't know if it's abridged or not. Many of the Overview books on JtR (Rumbelow, Begg, Sugden) cover the basic theory. Matters glosses over the actual syphilis aspect- it's a secondary motivation to his theory. It wasn't until R. Anderson's 2014 podcast (it was a presentation during one of The Whitechapel Society meetings) that I realized just how prevalent Syphilis was during Victorian Times.

Cohen, Druitt, Maybrick, and even Prince Eddy, are amongst those suspects mentioned as possible syphilitics (sp??), even aside from the Ripper connection.