Dressed to kill.

[Wickerman]

There's no head-banging involved, thats what her arms are for, to lean against.

Much of the time the penetration was said to be anal, maybe the low-cost option?

.

[curious4]

Was said?

Hello Wickerman,

"Was said"? By whom? This is not something I particularly want to pursue, but if we are to accept that Jack attacked his victims from behind, it should be established as a fact, not a guess, rumour or something "everybody says".

Best wishes,
C4

[lynn cates]

inter-femoral

Hello Jon, Gwyneth. Actually, it was inter-femoral.

Cheers.
LC

[curious4]

Victorian street sex

Hello Lynn,

Yes, I think you would be right in many cases - especially if the involved parties were very drunk.

Cheers,

Gwyneth

[Wickerman]

Hello Wickerman,

"Was said"? By whom? This is not something I particularly want to pursue, but if we are to accept that Jack attacked his victims from behind, it should be established as a fact, not a guess, rumour or something "everybody says".

Best wishes,
C4

Good luck in establishing anything as fact. Just read up on the social classes and how they functioned in the East End. Its not pretty but a necessary education for the likes of our generation who have life so easy in comparison.

.

[lynn cates]

And sober . . .

Hello Gwyneth. Thanks.

"Yes, I think you would be right in many cases - especially if the involved parties were very drunk."

Yes, there is an awkward moment regarding this with a sober chap in that ridiculous move, "From Hell."

Cheers.
LC

[Errata]

Hello Errata,

You don't take into account height differences and preferences. A certain amount of knee-bending on the customer's part would be necessary whatever, but where there's a will, there's a way. Presumably the "lady" would to a certain extent have to fall in with her customer's wishes, but I don't think one involving banging her head against a brick wall would be a favourite, especially when dealing with an enthusiastic customer.

Cheers,
C4

I do take into account height differences and preferences. Certainly there are work arounds, as men and women have been having sex face to face since the dawn of the species. Lying down, perching on a tall object, even the man lifting the woman is all perfectly normal. But we are discussing the sexual habits of men who solicit prostitutes. And while a man soliciting a prostitute may be interested in face to face interaction, kissing, even cuddling after, it's not the norm. Sex with prostitutes is by it's nature impersonal, even dehumanizing to the prostitute. And there are a bunch of theories why, but in the end none of them are germane to the discussion. The goal of a prostitute's customer is to get the most sexual gratification with the least amount of contact. Far and away the most common act performed by modern streetwalkers is oral sex. About 15 to 1. To the point that many prostitutes take to carrying very large purses so they have something to kneel on. And there are a lot of theories why that is true as well, but one of the more prevalent notions is that soliciting a prostitute is damaging to the male ego, and without some sort of reclamation of power the entire process doesn't work. Which given how closely linked a man's self confidence is with his virility is probably a fair guess. So to apply this to the life of a Victorian streetwalker, the men soliciting them are likely not interested in intimacy. Rear entry provides sexual satisfaction without the enforced intimacy of face to face contact, it gives the customer the greatest amount of control over the act itself, it allows the prostitute a greater chance of trapping her customer in her hands or between her thighs to prevent pregnancy is greater, and there is certainly a lot less inconvenience that lying down would generate. So logistically speaking, sex from behind is the most likely scenario, but by no means the only scenario.

[Wickerman]

.... Rear entry provides sexual satisfaction without the enforced intimacy of face to face contact, it gives the customer the greatest amount of control over the act itself, it allows the prostitute a greater chance of trapping her customer in her hands or between her thighs to prevent pregnancy is greater, and there is certainly a lot less inconvenience that lying down would generate. So logistically speaking, sex from behind is the most likely scenario, but by no means the only scenario.

Which makes me wonder, when we read in medical reports from the autopsy "no sign of connection", are they looking in the right location, if you get my meaning.
Would the learned doctors be street-smart, or remain guided by prudish values?

.

[lynn cates]

thighs

Hello Jon.

"Which makes me wonder, when we read in medical reports from the autopsy "no sign of connection", are they looking in the right location, if you get my meaning."

Loud and clear.

Yes, Llewellyn with Polly and Brown with Kate checked the thighs for "secretions." One may assume that, given his competence, Bagster did as well.

Cheers.
LC

[Wickerman]

Hello Jon.

"Which makes me wonder, when we read in medical reports from the autopsy "no sign of connection", are they looking in the right location, if you get my meaning."

Loud and clear.

Yes, Llewellyn with Polly and Brown with Kate checked the thighs for "secretions." One may assume that, given his competence, Bagster did as well.

Cheers.
LC

Hi Lynn.

You think "thighs" might be a euphemism?

.

[lynn cates]

back to work

Hello Jon. Thanks.

Not at all. That would be where the "secretions" would accumulate and dry. Polly was, according to Jane Oram, very clean. Since she had "earned" money 3 times the day of her death, doubtless she had washed each time.

I think we get a hint of this with Mary Ann Cox. She was out on the street, popped round to Miller's Court, then popped out again. Why? As a self-admitted "unfortunate," she had likely had success, come home to wash, then back to work.

Cheers.
LC

[Wickerman]

Hi Lynn.

Hello Jon. Thanks.

Not at all. That would be where the "secretions" would accumulate and dry.

Then you must be suggesting that none of these doctors actually made an internal examination?

.

[lynn cates]

routine

Hello Jon. Thanks.

No, no such suggestion. I presume that was done routinely as well.

Cheers.
LC

[Errata]

Hi Lynn.


Then you must be suggesting that none of these doctors actually made an internal examination?

.

Before the advent of DNA testing, the most likely place to find seminal secretion was on the thighs. One mixed with vaginal secretions, they would never find anything on the inside. And it's also a simple gravity thing. But evidence of actual penetration would have to come from an internal examination. Internal examination would also potentially reveal a pregnancy, and while ordinarily that would be evident in a woman cut open, with uteruses missing, the only way for them to establish a pregnancy would be the mucus plug in the cervix. Which is found digitally. Remember there was still an organ snatching for profit thing being entertained, and they could not ignore the idea that the uterus was removed in order to get at a first or second trimester fetus undamaged.

[Errata]

Although thighs is a euphemism. It's also a literalism. Essentialy it specifically refers to the thighs, and anything within a 12 inch radius.