Do post mortem mutilators typically communicate with the police?

[RivkahChaya]

Errata, I think I what you're getting at, if I may be so presumptuous.

Some killers are terrorists. Some are essentially rapists, with death or corpse fetishes that often go beyond necrophilia, to eating parts of bodies, or keeping bones as trophies, or extreme sadists, who aren't satisfied with S/M role-playing, and whose tortures usually lead to the victim's death, or who just don't care about the victim, and care about not getting caught, so they dispatch them at the end.

Some may be both, particularly if they get off on the panic they create.

If I'm not mistaken I seem to recall that Gary Ridgeway, the Green River Killer, wrote just one letter to the authorities at some point. There is also the Yosemite Killer, Cary Stayner, who sent directions to the FBI as to where to find the body of one of his victims, along with the taunting line "We had fun with this one." And he was definitely a mutilator, though not strictly a post-mortem one. He burned two dead bodies (strangled) in the trunk of a car, slashed the throat of the victim he referenced in the letter while she was alive, and beheaded another while she was alive.

BTK stated in interviews that he wanted to be a famous serial killer, so that's why he wrote to the police, and why he gave himself a nickname. That's about as twisted as it gets, and I'd have to call him a terrorist; Cary Stayner is a bit of an enigma, but he had been diagnosed with bipolar disorder, and even earlier with ADHD. He'd been prescribed medicine, but had been off it when he committed the murders. He may have written to the police during a full-manic episode, when people often feel invincible, may in a sense not have been the same person who committed the murders (I am in no way suggesting a dissociation, or a "split-personality," just a very drastic sort of mood swing that would have made him seem like a different people, even to those who knew him well).

The Zodiac was definitely a terrorist, who often had no physical contact with his victims. Ted Bundy, whether he actually raped his victims or not chose them because they resembled a woman he was angry at, for dumping him. He was seeking the same kind of power reassurance as a power-reassurance rapist. Killing a woman is an even more extreme way of taking control of her, and humiliating her. Bundy worked to elude the police, and moved around jurisdictions a lot. He never tried to communication with them. He also went sniveling to the electric chair. (I don't believe in capital punishment, but I still enjoy the irony of that. John Wayne Gacy did it too.)

[Errata]

It isn't typical for post mortem mutilators to seek attention, but there isn't anything about the act of mutilation that requires a killer to stay under the radar. Basically serial killers, as with most people, concentrate on a single aspect of any experience. I used to do theater, and there's lots to enjoy about being in a play. But if there wasn't applause, I wouldn't do it. Not that I don't enjoy the rehearsal process, the performing, etc. But I would do other things with that time if there wasn't a chance of a standing ovation.

Serial killers like Zodiac, Son of Sam, Unabomber are different because their focus is divided. If all they wanted was the attention, they could make up murders, or claim crimes as their own that they didn't commit, do any number of outrageous things. But they actually kill as well. So both aspects are important. They get something out of the act, and then out of the terror the act causes. Now for these guys, the attention was more important than the kill. And we know this because none of them made sure they killed all their victims, and some victims of all three survived. If ending a life was paramount, that would not be the case.

Mutilators are also different, for the same reason. Their focus is divided. The kill is important, and the mutilation is important. The one shining exception of course being Ed Gein. Mutilation murders are ritualistic, and I can see why a killer would have a problem ritualizing the mutilation but not the death. And while mutilators have had victims survive, it is incredibly rare. Whether these guys are more focused on the kill or on the mutilation almost doesn't matter. Killing is necessary for the mutilation to take place, or to dispose of a mutilated victim. Death is a requirement, not simply a preference.

It's hard to think that someone could be successful with a triply split focus. Especially due to the ritualistic component of mutilation. It's very personal, what they do. Even with the benefit of distance and time from the kill, mutilators tend to be reluctant to expose something so personal to the public. Sort of how people brag about their sex lives, but they don't talk about their feelings about their sex life. It's private. But clearly these guys are operating with damaged filters so just because the tendency is to protect that which is personal doesn't mean they won't publicize it in order to bask in the terror of the public.

As best I can tell, the mutilating serial killers with their intensely personal rituals that they know are unacceptable are the serial killers most invested in not getting caught. Son of Sam couldn't win unless he was identified. Zodiac put more thought into his codes than he did his crimes. Hell, Kemper turned himself in. Any number of serial killers seem philosophical about getting caught, many simply wishing they had been killed by police. Jeffrey Dahmer was terrified of getting caught. Ted Bundy fought like hell against capture. So if it is true that mutilators are the most invested in not getting caught, publicity seeking would seem counter intuitive. But again, it's not like we're talking about the most rational of minds, so it's not out of the question. I would expect however that anyone split three ways like that would screw up pretty early on in the process. Probably early enough that they don't actually qualify as serial killers.

[Bridewell]

Does anyone know of any serial killers who are in more in the lust killer, post mortem mutilator/necro serial killers (like Dahmer, Bundy, Green River, Gein, Brudos, Kemper)that wrote letters to the police/press?

Peter Kuerten the Dusseldorf Ripper?

[sdreid]

Off the top of my head, there was a letter from someone claiming to be the Cleveland Torso Slayer but was it really? His dissections were a form of mutilation but may have been more for the convenience of transportation than anything else so not a direct comparison to JtR even if the letter was real.

There aren't many postmortem mutilation serial killers who write letters but there aren't many serial killers who write letters nor serial killers who are postmortem mutilators.

[kensei]

If I'm not mistaken I seem to recall that Gary Ridgeway, the Green River Killer, wrote just one letter to the authorities at some point. There is also the Yosemite Killer, Cary Stayner, who sent directions to the FBI as to where to find the body of one of his victims, along with the taunting line "We had fun with this one." And he was definitely a mutilator, though not strictly a post-mortem one. He burned two dead bodies (strangled) in the trunk of a car, slashed the throat of the victim he referenced in the letter while she was alive, and beheaded another while she was alive.

[Abby Normal]

Seems to me in my brief knowledge of serial killers that post mortem mutilator serial killers dont typically write letters to the police/press. it seems to be more of the characteristic of thrill killers/mission killers like Zodiac, Unabomber and Son of Sam etc.

[B]Does anyone know of any serial killers who are in more in the lust killer, post mortem mutilator/necro serial killers (like Dahmer, Bundy, Green River, Gein, Brudos, Kemper)that wrote letters to the police/press?

BTK is the only one that comes to mind but he seemed to be less of a post mortem kind and more of a torture fetish(rope/strangulation) kind. As in he got off more on the act of strangling/aphyxiation then doing anything directly with the body after death.

I am inclined to think that the Ripper more than likely wrote the GSG and that either the Dear Boss or From hell letter was at least a 50/50 chance of coming from the Ripper. But if they did it does not seem typical of behavior that comes from the type of serial killer the ripper was.

Thoughts/comments?